Coronavirus - COVID-19

[beantownbubba]

One of the many ways in which The Internet has done us No Good is cramming every tragedy into our faces as though it happened next door. It's not only bad for the psyche, it messes with our ability to use numbers to perceive the world

Truth.

[Mundane Mayhem]

Like apparently everyone else, I am not happy with the state of things on this Board (by which I mean this and the politics thread). I accept my share of the blame for that and even more because of my frequent participation. But nobody who participates is blameless. If nobody wants it to be this way, why is it this way and why is it getting worse? I don't know and I'm sure that there are multiple reasons, but here are some thoughts:

One reason is that it's natural for people to get more dug in to their positions as time goes on which inherently raises the overall volume and the level of frustration of others. It's also natural for minor interpersonal irritations to expand into more serious conflicts over time which inevitably increases misunderstandings and can cause people to anticipate or assume the worst when that's not what's actually there on the screen. It's also natural (I think, at least it is for me) for people who are familiar with each other and their positions to use shorthand (particular terms used, assumptions made about what is universally understood, implicit references to past posts that are not immediately recognized by all readers in the way the writer assumes, etc) and that kind of shorthand inevitably leads to greater and mostly avoidable misunderstandings. I know that I am a prime example of the shorthand thing.

Additionally, I think everyone is at least occasionally guilty of one version or another of Cole's "showing off" point. I prefer to think of it as cleverness for cleverness's sake, but by whatever label it is unnecessary and almost guaranteed to generate misunderstandings and plain old annoyance. For a while I thought I had stopped doing this. I don't know if it's crept back in when I wasn't looking or I never really stopped but I've noticed it recently and am again trying to self-edit those kinds of things out even when I think "it's a really good one." The name of this game is, or should be, communication, not "gotcha."

The imbalance between the relatively large number of more liberal viewpoints and the relatively small number of more conservative viewpoints is inherently problematic. Those of us on the "majority" side need to be more careful about "ganging up" on a particular post or poster, repeatedly beating the dead horse of an issue already well addressed by others, being sloppy, inaccurate or insulting because we can, etc.

Even though we use screen names, for a long time many regular participants knew who each other was in non-virtual life and often we had met and spent real life time together. Anonymity breeds incivility and disrespect and getting behind the wall of anonymity breeds civility and respect. I think fewer current regular participants know each other in that way and it shows. Hopefully we'll all have more opportunities to attend more rock shows now and meet each other.

The other thing that I have railed against over and over and which keeps coming back is that all of us attribute to any single poster the worst and most extreme views and statements of any person, party or institution remotely connected to the "same side" of the issue that the poster is advocating. It makes serious, earnest discussion almost impossible and often distorts or obscures the actual point the poster is trying to make. I find this infuriating when I'm that poster being saddled with views I don't share and only slightly less so when I read it in responses to posts by others. I am really big on trying to avoid this - being more careful about the pronouns I use, thinking hard about whether attributing a viewpoint or statement to a poster here is really fair given what I know about that person, thinking about whether I can make my point without bringing in those "outside influences," etc, and just recently I've noticed that I've been doing this. I regret it and intend to stop doing it. If I had to pick a single factor that contributes the most to the current toxicity, this might well be it. Everyone hates it when it's done to them, pretty much everyone does it to others and it always escalates the volume and reduces and obscures the substance.

I'm sure there's a lot more including the fact that all of us are immersed to at least some extent in social media or online culture and that's just plain toxic. We all bring some of that here with us. I think we used to be well better than average about smoothing off those rough edges, bad habits and irritants; lately we're just more of the same. Or maybe I'm kidding myself that we were ever above average.

I don't know all the questions and I sure don't have all the answers but I do know that everyone who participates here is dissatisfied with the current state of things. That has to be a good starting point. Who knows? If we all try to do our part, recognizing at least some of how we contribute to the nastiness, consciously trying to stop doing those things, giving the other person the benefit of the doubt and taking a literal or metaphorical deep breath before responding maybe things will get better. I know all of that is easier said than done and maybe it's foolish/naive to think we can escape the inevitable result of the nature of this form of communication and the dysfunction in the wider world but I think it's worth a try.

I remain tapped out for purposes of this discussion, but popping in quickly to say that this post hits on a lot of the reasons that I tapped out in the first place.

To wit, I’m a relative nobody around these parts and haven’t met any of y’all in the flesh. We might’ve stood next to each other at 40 Watt urinals a time or two.

Without a reservoir of goodwill and good faith built up, it’s just not worth it to me to continue to dig in my heels on this shit. So I don’t think I’ll be rejoining the fray here, but wanted to post my appreciation for these sentiments.

Happy to buy a beer for anyone here in SLC, New Orleans, or Athens.

[John A Arkansawyer]

haven’t met any of y’all in the flesh.

So that night at the Chautauqua meant nothing to you? You cad!

[Mundane Mayhem]

haven’t met any of y’all in the flesh.

So that night at the Chautauqua meant nothing to you? You cad!

The one notable exception!

[beantownbubba]

We need some damn setlists to discuss! Maybe bring back song of the week or something.

I think this is much deeper/more important than it might seem at first glance.

How do we get to know each other when we don't see each other in person? By trading stories, information, opinions, background, etc online. When this site (the whole site) was much more active, many, many people participated more broadly, whether it was in the DBT or Other Music fora or the many threads on innumerable topics in Everything Else.

Simply put, it is much harder to be angry at someone and much easier to give someone the benefit of the doubt when it turns out that you share an obscure passion or she (remember when women participated?) turned you on to a band or you knew of some personal troubles they were undergoing or it turns out that you each had an older sibling who turned you on to the Ramones when all your friends were listening to...not the Ramones, or it turns out that you were both at that concert in 1992 that changed both your lives, etc, etc. Also, it was a regular reminder that we are all proud members of a small cult that is passionate about a band, which is no small thing to have in common. So one answer to the current conflicts is to participate more or more broadly on the board. I don't know how likely that is at this point in time but I think it would be a welcome development, fun and would actually have an impact on the negative tone.

Similarly, there were a lot more "community based" or "community building" activities in the old days. I am really proud of the money we raised for various individuals and causes. That still goes on to a large extent but it's based in FB. Even something as simple and cliched as birthday greetings helped humanize others that were just screen names. At this point I generally don't start birthday threads because I'm concerned that nobody or only a very few will respond and that would be counter to the purpose. But it would be good if we could get that critical mass back. I can remember deciding whether to post on LJ's birthday thread: Would it be hypocritical? Would he be more insulted than pleased? But I went ahead because just thinking of him as a human being celebrating a birthday made me feel a little more favorably disposed to him which was a good thing.

A good contrast when it comes to tone and the extended benefits of good vibes were some of the sports threads, especially the college football thread. Those kinds of threads tend to generate the old fashioned healthy kind of trash talk, the kind that binds and that is often just plain funny. Again, it's hard to get too mad at someone with whom you've traded insults w/ over your respective alma maters or if you were the 2 finalists in the basketball pool. IOW, humanizing stuff that contributes to making better humans and a better, warmer community.

Another benefit of participating more widely is that it diffuses focus/attention. When the only active thread is politics or a single issue hot button, it shines a very harsh spotlight on that thread and increases its apparent importance beyond it's actual meaning. If people were also posting about their vacations, their latest netflix find, their new hobby, etc etc, the whole tone of things would be different and the pressure and focus on the "hotter" threads would be lowered. And again, it's actually fun. The things I've learned on this Board across an incredibly broad range of subjects would fill several books.

The audience for a post like this may just be those who are already the most active participants on the board and/or these particular threads, which is just preaching to the converted. But for all you lurkers and occasional or "special limited purpose" posters, consider this an invitation to jump in: The water may appear to be boiling but it's actually quite refreshing.

[boyyourself]

Like apparently everyone else, I am not happy with the state of things on this Board (by which I mean this and the politics thread). I accept my share of the blame for that and even more because of my frequent participation. But nobody who participates is blameless. If nobody wants it to be this way, why is it this way and why is it getting worse? I don't know and I'm sure that there are multiple reasons, but here are some thoughts:

One reason is that it's natural for people to get more dug in to their positions as time goes on which inherently raises the overall volume and the level of frustration of others. It's also natural for minor interpersonal irritations to expand into more serious conflicts over time which inevitably increases misunderstandings and can cause people to anticipate or assume the worst when that's not what's actually there on the screen. It's also natural (I think, at least it is for me) for people who are familiar with each other and their positions to use shorthand (particular terms used, assumptions made about what is universally understood, implicit references to past posts that are not immediately recognized by all readers in the way the writer assumes, etc) and that kind of shorthand inevitably leads to greater and mostly avoidable misunderstandings. I know that I am a prime example of the shorthand thing.

Additionally, I think everyone is at least occasionally guilty of one version or another of Cole's "showing off" point. I prefer to think of it as cleverness for cleverness's sake, but by whatever label it is unnecessary and almost guaranteed to generate misunderstandings and plain old annoyance. For a while I thought I had stopped doing this. I don't know if it's crept back in when I wasn't looking or I never really stopped but I've noticed it recently and am again trying to self-edit those kinds of things out even when I think "it's a really good one." The name of this game is, or should be, communication, not "gotcha."

The imbalance between the relatively large number of more liberal viewpoints and the relatively small number of more conservative viewpoints is inherently problematic. Those of us on the "majority" side need to be more careful about "ganging up" on a particular post or poster, repeatedly beating the dead horse of an issue already well addressed by others, being sloppy, inaccurate or insulting because we can, etc.

Even though we use screen names, for a long time many regular participants knew who each other was in non-virtual life and often we had met and spent real life time together. Anonymity breeds incivility and disrespect and getting behind the wall of anonymity breeds civility and respect. I think fewer current regular participants know each other in that way and it shows. Hopefully we'll all have more opportunities to attend more rock shows now and meet each other.

The other thing that I have railed against over and over and which keeps coming back is that all of us attribute to any single poster the worst and most extreme views and statements of any person, party or institution remotely connected to the "same side" of the issue that the poster is advocating. It makes serious, earnest discussion almost impossible and often distorts or obscures the actual point the poster is trying to make. I find this infuriating when I'm that poster being saddled with views I don't share and only slightly less so when I read it in responses to posts by others. I am really big on trying to avoid this - being more careful about the pronouns I use, thinking hard about whether attributing a viewpoint or statement to a poster here is really fair given what I know about that person, thinking about whether I can make my point without bringing in those "outside influences," etc, and just recently I've noticed that I've been doing this. I regret it and intend to stop doing it. If I had to pick a single factor that contributes the most to the current toxicity, this might well be it. Everyone hates it when it's done to them, pretty much everyone does it to others and it always escalates the volume and reduces and obscures the substance.

I'm sure there's a lot more including the fact that all of us are immersed to at least some extent in social media or online culture and that's just plain toxic. We all bring some of that here with us. I think we used to be well better than average about smoothing off those rough edges, bad habits and irritants; lately we're just more of the same. Or maybe I'm kidding myself that we were ever above average.

I don't know all the questions and I sure don't have all the answers but I do know that everyone who participates here is dissatisfied with the current state of things. That has to be a good starting point. Who knows? If we all try to do our part, recognizing at least some of how we contribute to the nastiness, consciously trying to stop doing those things, giving the other person the benefit of the doubt and taking a literal or metaphorical deep breath before responding maybe things will get better. I know all of that is easier said than done and maybe it's foolish/naive to think we can escape the inevitable result of the nature of this form of communication and the dysfunction in the wider world but I think it's worth a try.

Thanks for the thoughtful post Bubba. It’s much appreciated.

[Cole Younger]

We need some damn setlists to discuss! Maybe bring back song of the week or something.

I think this is much deeper/more important than it might seem at first glance.

How do we get to know each other when we don't see each other in person? By trading stories, information, opinions, background, etc online. When this site (the whole site) was much more active, many, many people participated more broadly, whether it was in the DBT or Other Music fora or the many threads on innumerable topics in Everything Else.

Simply put, it is much harder to be angry at someone and much easier to give someone the benefit of the doubt when it turns out that you share an obscure passion or she (remember when women participated?) turned you on to a band or you knew of some personal troubles they were undergoing or it turns out that you each had an older sibling who turned you on to the Ramones when all your friends were listening to...not the Ramones, or it turns out that you were both at that concert in 1992 that changed both your lives, etc, etc. Also, it was a regular reminder that we are all proud members of a small cult that is passionate about a band, which is no small thing to have in common. So one answer to the current conflicts is to participate more or more broadly on the board. I don't know how likely that is at this point in time but I think it would be a welcome development, fun and would actually have an impact on the negative tone.

Similarly, there were a lot more "community based" or "community building" activities in the old days. I am really proud of the money we raised for various individuals and causes. That still goes on to a large extent but it's based in FB. Even something as simple and cliched as birthday greetings helped humanize others that were just screen names. At this point I generally don't start birthday threads because I'm concerned that nobody or only a very few will respond and that would be counter to the purpose. But it would be good if we could get that critical mass back. I can remember deciding whether to post on LJ's birthday thread: Would it be hypocritical? Would he be more insulted than pleased? But I went ahead because just thinking of him as a human being celebrating a birthday made me feel a little more favorably disposed to him which was a good thing.

A good contrast when it comes to tone and the extended benefits of good vibes were some of the sports threads, especially the college football thread. Those kinds of threads tend to generate the old fashioned healthy kind of trash talk, the kind that binds and that is often just plain funny. Again, it's hard to get too mad at someone with whom you've traded insults w/ over your respective alma maters or if you were the 2 finalists in the basketball pool. IOW, humanizing stuff that contributes to making better humans and a better, warmer community.

Another benefit of participating more widely is that it diffuses focus/attention. When the only active thread is politics or a single issue hot button, it shines a very harsh spotlight on that thread and increases its apparent importance beyond it's actual meaning. If people were also posting about their vacations, their latest netflix find, their new hobby, etc etc, the whole tone of things would be different and the pressure and focus on the "hotter" threads would be lowered. And again, it's actually fun. The things I've learned on this Board across an incredibly broad range of subjects would fill several books.

The audience for a post like this may just be those who are already the most active participants on the board and/or these particular threads, which is just preaching to the converted. But for all you lurkers and occasional or "special limited purpose" posters, consider this an invitation to jump in: The water may appear to be boiling but it's actually quite refreshing.

Damn it, boy! You are a wise man. I think you hit the nail on the head. I haven’t participated as much over the last year or two mostly because few of the people I know participate here much anymore. I see screen names at the bottom of the page occasionally but they seldom post or never do. I’ve done the same. I’ve popped in briefly over the last year or two a lot more than I’ve done any contributing. And I just can not do Facebook. There is just so much that I find repulsive about social media (yes I realize this is a form of social media. Y’all know what I mean) for me to ever go back there. The day I deleted my Facebook account was one of the better decisions I’ve made in my life. Watch the movie The Social Dilemma if you haven’t. I had long since deleted my account when I did. But there is a lot in what you’re saying.

I think me and Iowan kind of became friendly over our shared love of certain country music artists. Same with me and Smitty. Me and whatwouldcooleydo did the same because of our shared love of old school Southern professional wrestling. He ended up gifting me the entire Foxfire book series which is collection of books on old time Southern Appalachian living, stories, etc and is one of my prized posessions and I think about him every time I’m reading one of those books which I do often. I’ve bonded with different people here over our mutual enjoyment of certain books and authors. I’ve shared tragedies with people here and celebrated personal milestones with them and yes birthdays back when we did that. I don’t know that bovinekenevel and I have ever talked about much but I’m pretty sure that guy has participated in every person’s birthday thread ever started. I don’t much at all about him but that makes me feel good about him. I’ve probably clashed with tinnitus more than anyone else here (we’ve also had periods of detente). But I remember some posts he made a few years back sharing pics from a vacation or something and it made him just seem like a regular guy having a good time in a place I thought I would probably enjoy too. These kinds of things are not only important they put the political stuff in proper perspective as not being all that important. Dave Chappelle said something as a guest on Joe Rogan a few months ago that I loved. He talked about how much he disliked how hyper political everything has become. He said, “I don’t care about people’s political views very much. I’m not gonna throw away a whole person over political views.”

This is a clumsy way of illustrating why I think you’re right. My dad absolutely loathed Bill Clinton. Despised him. SomHe wasn’t real warm on James Carrville either. But then he found out Carville had his own college football radio show and was an enlisted Marine. When he found that out he said, “Hell, how bad can he really be?”

[beantownbubba]

Ages and ages ago Iowan suggested that we have a "like" button here. I like the previous 2 posts but don't want to add to the clutter by reposting them just to say "like," lol.

Cole, those are perfect examples of what I had in mind. And, oh, btw, I've also left facebook and my life is the better for it though I do miss keeping up w/ lots of people, many of whom should be posting here if they knew what was good for them.

[phungi]

Meeting people in-person is definitely preferred to online.

Cole, while I would have eventually figured out you were a damned decent individual through the message boards, it wouldn't have been the same had we not met at a rock show. Having met you, though, there is little you could post that would change my mind on this... however, since this is a COVID thread, I will definitely buy you a beer should we be lucky enough to be in the same place again, but kissing is 100% off-limits.

Same goes for you, Bubba, despite your vax-positive status.

[Cole Younger]

Meeting people in-person is definitely preferred to online.

Cole, while I would have eventually figured out you were a damned decent individual through the message boards, it wouldn't have been the same had we not met at a rock show. Having met you, though, there is little you could post that would change my mind on this... however, since this is a COVID thread, I will definitely buy you a beer should we be lucky enough to be in the same place again, but kissing is 100% off-limits.

Same goes for you, Bubba, despite your vax-positive status.

And I was looking so forward to a big wet kiss from you. I was gonna shave for you.

[beantownbubba]

I was gonna shave for you.

Wow, phungi, you are clearly held in very high esteem by someone.

Same goes for you, Bubba

I am crushed, all my illusions are shattered.

[tinnitus photography]

echoing others' statements... it does no good when debate is shifted to malice and venom, which is what this thread turned to months ago (and yes i cop to my contributions).

i'll be sure to post some photos of the Dimmer Twins in a few days, as they clamber back to the hallowed grounds of The Fort.

[Cole Younger]

Looking forward to seeing them, tinnitus. I’ll be posting up pics from a trout fishing trip I’ll be leaving for in the morning.
I’ll be fishing and camping in Rabun County for the next few days and posting up crappy cell phone camera pics. If Rabun County Georgia sounds familiar to anyone it’s because the movie Deliverance was filmed there. I’m good though since I’m from here. Plus as y’all who have met me know, I ain’t got a pretty mouth anyway.

[Mundane Mayhem]

Looking forward to seeing them, tinnitus. I’ll be posting up pics from a trout fishing trip I’ll be leaving for in the morning.
I’ll be fishing and camping in Rabun County for the next few days and posting up crappy cell phone camera pics. If Rabun County Georgia sounds familiar to anyone it’s because the movie Deliverance was filmed there. I’m good though since I’m from here. Plus as y’all who have met me know, I ain’t got a pretty mouth anyway.

Pretty country. I pass through there regularly, as my in-laws live in (and my wife is from) Macon County, NC. Goats on the Roof is our landmark that we're entering the home stretch.

[Cole Younger]

Looking forward to seeing them, tinnitus. I’ll be posting up pics from a trout fishing trip I’ll be leaving for in the morning.
I’ll be fishing and camping in Rabun County for the next few days and posting up crappy cell phone camera pics. If Rabun County Georgia sounds familiar to anyone it’s because the movie Deliverance was filmed there. I’m good though since I’m from here. Plus as y’all who have met me know, I ain’t got a pretty mouth anyway.

Pretty country. I pass through there regularly, as my in-laws live in (and my wife is from) Macon County, NC. Goats on the Roof is our landmark that we're entering the home stretch.

Yep. I love it there. It has changed some though since it has been “discovered” by the outside world.

[tinnitus photography]

Looking forward to seeing them, tinnitus. I’ll be posting up pics from a trout fishing trip I’ll be leaving for in the morning.
I’ll be fishing and camping in Rabun County for the next few days and posting up crappy cell phone camera pics. If Rabun County Georgia sounds familiar to anyone it’s because the movie Deliverance was filmed there. I’m good though since I’m from here. Plus as y’all who have met me know, I ain’t got a pretty mouth anyway.

sounds awesome. my granddad used to take me and my brother trout fishing when we were young, but trolling from a small boat. my brother and did plenty of small stream and pond fishing on our own, too.

fill that creel!

[Cole Younger]

Looking forward to seeing them, tinnitus. I’ll be posting up pics from a trout fishing trip I’ll be leaving for in the morning.
I’ll be fishing and camping in Rabun County for the next few days and posting up crappy cell phone camera pics. If Rabun County Georgia sounds familiar to anyone it’s because the movie Deliverance was filmed there. I’m good though since I’m from here. Plus as y’all who have met me know, I ain’t got a pretty mouth anyway.

sounds awesome. my granddad used to take me and my brother trout fishing when we were young, but trolling from a small boat. my brother and did plenty of small stream and pond fishing on our own, too.

fill that creel!

Thanks, buddy I’m gonna do my best. It will be fun for sure.

[phungi]

...fill that creel!

(and get vaxed)

[boyyourself]

How many Hurricane Katrina refugees can you fit in a shopping cart? Read on if you want to find out the truth in the humor. This will be fun for me as I haven't thought of this in a long time so here goes. Basically I'd like to tell some stories that hopefully tie together why the politicization of natural disasters, pandemics, other bad news, has frustrated me for a long time. But also how it's cool to see people rally and help neighbors in need, and I love that side of humanity.

I'll never forget being really young and my dad explaining to me how the news works and what gets reported and why, "son they will show you a tiny little portion of what's happening on the news, meanwhile out of camera shot is all kinds of stuff going on that they don't want to show you" OK pops. So now I'm a woke young cowboy. Not easy to deal with for the next 40 years.

When Katrina hit I had already been planning to go to Austin to ACL fest, but decided to go down a couple weeks early to help at the Austin Civic center, which was made into a Katrina refugee shelter for I think It was a couple thousand people. I had to sign up with red cross to volunteer.
On the covic center floor was where everyone had their own tarp space which were laid out in rows, equipped with cots and blankets etc. Not ideal by any means, but everyone was safe and well fed. There was plenty of food.

I asked the person in charge of volunteers if anyone was doing anything to entertain the kids, he said no and that i should go for it. These kids were sort of stuck on a tarp with their mom. Seemed like lots of single moms. So I started going around and introducing myself to parents and kids and asking the kids if they wanted to walk around. The moms and kids alike were thrilled. Then I found a shopping cart. Oh shit. So I start loading them in and now we are hauling ass all over the halls of the civic center.
8 inside and who knows how many running along side. Taking turns getting rides in the cart. I did that for ten days. Show up with the cart and off we would go. Would get big hugs from the moms. The best part.
And you know I had my pulse on that place a little but. Were conditions ideal? What would be in that situation? I don't know I saw a lot of cool stuff happen after some bad shit happened.

So one day I notice a news van parked outside. Mind you, I had sort of taken on ownership of the place by this point.
And I notice they were interviewing one of the refugees. So I started inching closer to see what they were asking him but don't recall being able to hear.
Later that night as I turn on the TV to Austin news is when part of this tale hopefully comes full circle, what do they lead the news with? You guessed it........"ladies and gentlemen tonight a special report on how terrible the conditions are for refugees down at the civic center"
Huh? Shouldn't be surprised thanks to the old man. Exhibit a.
And the other story that was all over the news that week that had me aghast was this black preacher from Austin who was offended that nobody had called him to ask him to come down to the shelter to help out. Do what now? Nobody asked me to get on plane from Colorado to Austin, so instead of just helping he wants to be a bitch in public. Anyways all that combined was upsetting to see.
.
Then one day I was rolling some kids around in our cart and this cop says hey man I am gonna need to take that cart. What? We need to get it back to the grocery store. You want to take this from these kids? And they are all piled in and clinging to the sides,...no I guess not he says. What dick. So then, true story, I said I've been watching you guys for about a week now and all you do is stand in the corner with your arms crossed looking mad, why don't you go out and mingle with people, think that might be a better way to go then just mad dogging the scene? And now you try to take our cart? Come on man. And then we carted of.

The awesome parts? How many people rallied to volunteer, although it dwindled towards the end. Not nearly enough help. But plenty of donations and lots of people were getting hooked up with housing. We loaded city busses with everything a family could need and more.

I moved one family in by myself. Couldn't believe we were out of help at that point. Preacher was busy practicing his victim stance I guess. A mom, grandma, and three kids sat on top of half a bus load of stuff to drive out to there new third floor apartment. It was a big scene. Mom couldn't help. 3 kids. Grandma couldn't help. Too old. Half a city bus up 3 flights I got this. Then after a couple trips I got real annoyed at crowd that was hanging around watching the whole scene so I says to them hey, you really just gonna stand there and watch me do this shit by myself or you gonna come help? They jumped to it and we busted it out.

I was also frustrated at how the narrative in the national news was all about how Bush didn't do.enough or whatever but all I could think of was assholes sitting on their asses watching the news and doing all they can to let go of the remote long enough to shake a fist. Instead of actually lifting a finger. Bush's fault trumps fault reeeeeeeeeee!!!!!. Thanks for that Cole. I'm moving furniture out of kindness. No one even really knew I was there. No Facebook and shit. And you assholes are out their playing the victim and playing the blame game and even worse, trying to control the info to suit your narrative because you can't handle the truth and you refuse to get off your ass. Now that a bad combo.

Only a couple things to say about covid politics. Already said a lot about that. Surprisingly, I was surprised a virus got politicized. Duh. Then watching the sides divide up into virus tribes was easy to predict really. But it was still fascinating and frustrating to watch and goddamm if it wasn't a Trump infused pandemic in an election year no less.

Last year's Trump rally in Tulsa was all the rage. BUT. The media couldn't decide how to report on that shit because remember, they wanted you to think no one would vote for trump.and wanted the narrative to be that the turn out was pathetic because everyone hates Trump.
BUT covid was ramping up and it was becoming trendy to blame trumpers and other aliens for socializing, that of course lumps you with Facebook and fox news as being a murderer. Sooooooo which is it Fuckers??? Well that's a rhetorical question because they talking out both sides of their asses. You wanted us to believe that no one was there because who on earth would vote Trump. Aaaand you wanted us to believe, at the exact same time, that it was overly crowded, which of course is bad because of covid and makes you dumb murdering southerners. Which. Is. It. Fuckers.....?? Its all bs. That's what. I see through it.
I'll decipher my own truths thank you. And thanks dad.

[beantownbubba]

EIGHT in a cart??!! Either that cart was TX sized or that must have been like a 50's frat stunt Either way it sounds like a blast. Thanks for all you did and thanks for the stories. Your stories also remind me of my regular reaction to the news these days: Why did some person take a video when they could have been helping? Sometimes there's nothing a bystander can do, but often there is.

BY, you are oh so right to be skeptical about the news. No bout a doubt it. Part of it in the Austin/Katrina context you describe is the "man bites dog" thing (i.e. that's news while dog bites man is not) which may be unfortunate in some ways but if people helping people becomes the news story I suspect we'll all be in a very bad place and there's some comfort (or maybe it's relief) to be taken in the bad parts being considered the news. I've been on the inside of news stories a few times and the media never got it totally right, so we all need to set our expectations, skepticism and analytical abilities accordingly - it's virtually impossible to know any story as well as those inside it know it and if you add in the pressures of instant reporting and analysis and the clamor to be heard above the incredible constant din, mistakes are more like a feature, not a bug, of the "system".

But also consider how much of one's viewpoint is affected by "which part of the elephant one is touching" (let me know if you don't know that reference). Even if the media covered Austin in the positive way you suggest, it still would only have been a small part of a big story. If you want to say that all parts of the story should be covered I'd agree but I'd also say that's unrealistic. Inevitably, some of the emergency sites were managed better than others, some were largely positive experiences and others were mostly negative and even at the positive sites there will have been negative individual experiences (even if they are a more a matter of the personality of the complaining person than the actual reality). Reporting only the negative is problematic in important ways but again, if the positive becomes the "man bites dog" story, we're all sunk. Also the positive stories (of which I remember many) tend to be the "human interest features" and not the leading news. None of this is to relieve the media of responsibility for what it does and doesn't do but just to say that we all need to have a healthy skepticism about all kinds of news.

FWIW, my recollection of the Tulsa coverage, which is of course limited by the sources I rely on, is that stories were oriented towards the "super spreader" angle before the event but when it was so poorly attended, it was the poor attendance that became the story. Just one person's hazy memories.

This is obviously about something you wrote, but I really truly hope that you will not see it as a personal attack because it is not meant that way. If you're bothered by this post for any reason say the word and I'll delete it.

[boyyourself]

I appreciate your response. Wasn't sure if you were asking me if I was bothered by it.

[beantownbubba]

Wasn't sure if you were asking me if I was bothered by it.

I was.

Coincidentally, the NYT has a story today about how some want to be buyers are dropping out of the housing market. While there are some controversial issues influencing the housing market, real estate is not the hot button emotional issue some others are so I thought it might be interesting to ask a few questions, like:

What made the Times run that story now?
When did they first notice this "trend?"
What makes a trend v. a few isolated instances?
Was the idea for the story provoked by the personal experience of a reporter or editor (or of someone close to them)?

There is nothing particularly timely or not timely about this story: While it's obviously about the currently hot real estate market that's much more a month to month story than an hourly or weekly story like a hurricane or a presidential speech or the announcement of a Supreme Court decision. When did it become "news?" Is it actually "news?"

Is this more of a good news or bad news story? I guess that depends on whether one's a buyer, seller, real estate agent or other interested party.
Might the story itself become the news in that the story itself might encourage other buyers to pause their searches so that the story actually creates a more widely experienced and reported news story?
Will other news outlets pick up this story and will that create its own momentum in the same manner as suggested by the previous question?
If any of that happens what exactly is the news and what's the reporting of the news?

A lot of discretion and judgment calls go into the reporting and release of a story and a lot of consequences, intended and not, flow from those decisions.

[boyyourself]

The housing situation is particularly crazy out here in western Colorado. Telluride itself is bonkers. A billion in real estate for 2020 which was a record by a few hundred million, I've been managing properties, mostly second homes, I see people out of nowhere buying these 6 to 12 million dollar places and then spending 2 on a remodel.
My buddy is getting into appraisals and was telling me about how the people that are training him also have investment properties in the area, and so they have a financial stake in jacking up neighborhood prices.
6 or 7 years ago just after divorce I was playing the rentL game here all of a sudden, and found myself paying $900 a month for a lock off guest unit with no kitchen, and 20 miles away. I basically panicked and got lucky and bought the condo I live now 2 miles from town. Lucky.
Hard to work and live here if not impossible. Opportunities are insane. My 14 year old spent all summer making 13 an hour but would pull about $100 in tips in six hours. For punching in orders at a counter service burger joint, go girl. 2 years ago it wasn't like that here. There is no lull in the restraunts anymore anytime of day, and traffic in and out of town is non stop. Bye bye to sleepy little Telluride.

So I pretty much have a financial stake in covid, especially considering my only investments are this condo and 3 acres in Olathe. And that property has sky rocketed in value since I bought it 2 and a half years ago. Ironically for the purpose of pandemic living, although at the time I had no clue what a pandemic was. Plus I new I didn't want to be in mountains forever. So it was more of a pro active move.
I can't imagine five years from now trying to buy property in
Western Colorado. So for me it was a bit of forethought with a lot of dumb luck. Nasty divorce is why the farm was even for sale.

Honestly some of my covid frustrations I've let go of simply for the fact that my 14 year old has her own mind and makes her choices. And that hasn't been easy to deal with but after several years of only having her half time I started learning to let go what I can't control. She got the Vax without she and her mom even really talking to me about it. Respect. The school been saying if you Vax you don't have to mask. Fine. Well not fine. It's bs. Anyways what happens when they change that to say everyone mask even if vaxxed? They can and likely will, looking at what's going on. Then it's no longer your body your choice. It's comply or else. As long as she knows that which she does.
So at that point they are just playing cosmetic theater with her body, and the science says we are perfect. Although the banner hanging over town says "we are not out of the weeds. Get vaxxed!" So I say perfection, you say I the weeds. Now those are perspectives that are worlds apart. But I don't control the info on the banner.

[boyyourself]

Why do we keep testing people with no symptoms? Why do we keep testing those have been vaxxed? Because infection rates are still the crucial numbers? They are to the covid bros I guess. I would guess that death rates continue drop the more we test . Or are there bodies piling up at a rate higher than say 2019?

Try finding the up to date death rates. They aren't as sexy as infection rates these days.

[bovine knievel]

Just scrolling through to catch up and wanted to say I love all of you, Muthafuckers. I don’t participate much in these threads for lots of reasons. We are all Heathens. Glad to see the cease-fire.

Cole, when we cross paths… drinks are on me

[beantownbubba]

Just scrolling through to catch up and wanted to say I love all of you, Muthafuckers.

Back atcha, ya big lug. Thought of you when the Dimmer Twins played "The Opening Act" in Boston last night.

[bovine knievel]

Just scrolling through to catch up and wanted to say I love all of you, Muthafuckers.

Back atcha, ya big lug. Thought of you when the Dimmer Twins played "The Opening Act" in Boston last night.

[boyyourself]

https://news.yahoo.com/exclusive-over-h ... 26985.html

Shocker

[boyyourself]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... scientists


Scientists are puzzled. What's puzzling to me is that we keep testing people that are vaxxed, people with no symptoms etc. It's not that puzzling considering those who still want to use inflated covid numbers to push whatever they are pushing. With infection rates as high as they are, the death rate of this virus has to be plummeting.

[boyyourself]

https://datavisualizations.heritage.org ... hs-by-age/


These are more important numbers to look at imo than just watching the ticker on the number of new cases. Especially considering at this point its seemingly literally everywhere. And to caveat, I am not trying to stir shit at all, just thinking out loud. I think it's been everywhere for a long time and it's just non stop testing which I don't get but I do.

Imo there's a lot to be gleaned from death rate by age. Not the least of which is that your immune system weakens with age naturally.
Also it's not one size fits all and never should've been treated as such. Especially lock down orders, school closures, mask mandates. Etc. All with dire unintended consequences. Like bezos going to space. Or over a billion masks in the ocean in 2020. How many by 5 years? Now they come fancy wrapped in plastic and other packaging and its trendy to display them on racks near the cash register. For what? it's a global pandemic.
Wants troubling is that where does it end? Who stand to gain from it ending or even a narrative of progress? The covid game and the blame game to follow ain't going nowhere It doesn't look like.

Also Amazon is building a brand new facility in Amarillo, brilliant location. They will have zero problems finding people to stuff your boxes for minimum wage. Also most of those gmo carbs we all get shipped to our door now are grown right in that region. Soy. Corn. And wheat baby. Also a great deal of feedlot cattle and confinement pork facilities pepper the region. BTW those cattle and pigs are also living mostly on the same wheat corn and soy that they toss into your box. That's mega amounts of momocropping and general soil mismanagement. With a giant slice of animal cruelty. Pesticides. Herbicides. Round Up. Etc. Monsanto and Amazon in cahoots to supply your pandemic needs so you don't have to leave the house. Wow.
All this requires a shit ton of fossil fuel from beginning to end. It's the polar opposite of how to sustain life while protecting the planet. If that's the goal.

More lockdowns and masking and vaxxing might help people. Great. Then they should do that. But they don't help kids or otherwise healthy adults.
Same as hybrid busses and building more crap and calling it green energy is also not going to mitigate climate change. No way. Hell I literally know people who are investing in cheap land to rubbish wind turbine blades that Nobody wants. They are only lasting seven years. 7. That's not exactly 20 like they said. Now they just going Into landfill which we are building just for them. Super green I'm sure.
Solar panels? Whole other can of worms.