I find it interesting that this story is about a week old and this post is the first I heard of it. File under "Bubbles, dangers of."Cole Younger wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 5:43 pm@boyyourself, Coca Cola and Miller-Coors telling their employees to act “less white” surpasses all recent permutations of political stupidity IMO.
The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
Moderators: Jonicont, mark lynn, Maluca3, Tequila Cowboy, BigTom, CooleyGirl, olwiggum
-
- Posts: 21837
- Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2010 10:52 am
- Location: Trying to stay focused on the righteous path
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
All opinions and commentary in my posts are solely my own and are made in my personal capacity.
-
- Posts: 957
- Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2010 9:38 pm
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
The story of multi nationals trying to control minds is as old as multi nationals.
Coca Cola started the "dont litter" campaign back in the day, with the crying Indian. Why? Because it was cheaper for them to make new bottles than buy back used ones for five cents, thus putting the ownice on you-----even though they're the assholes cranking out millions of tons of waste. All so everyone can have have that liquid sugar straight to the dome. Sounds like an ecological disaster with a slice of pandemic waiting to happen. Ironically now I'm hearing we are running out of glass viles for vaccines. Where are they ending up? And Where do more come from? The earth I suppose. Oh well, it's your civic duty not to litter and get a vaccine and whatnot.
Coca Cola started the "dont litter" campaign back in the day, with the crying Indian. Why? Because it was cheaper for them to make new bottles than buy back used ones for five cents, thus putting the ownice on you-----even though they're the assholes cranking out millions of tons of waste. All so everyone can have have that liquid sugar straight to the dome. Sounds like an ecological disaster with a slice of pandemic waiting to happen. Ironically now I'm hearing we are running out of glass viles for vaccines. Where are they ending up? And Where do more come from? The earth I suppose. Oh well, it's your civic duty not to litter and get a vaccine and whatnot.
-
- Posts: 3989
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 6:34 pm
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
A buddy of mine works at Miller-Coors and showed me the video they had to watch. I cracked up watching it but if I was forced to watch something like that at my job with management putting pressure on us to actually give horse shit like that a serious thought I guess I would have a decision to make. I know myself and I would probably get booted or put on suspension for asking, “So if we have to act less white, are we supposed to act more black? Hispanic? Asian? What are y’all shooting for? Which race/nationality is ok?”. Luckily, doing what I do for a living there is none of this kind of insanity and you had better leave your feelings in the truck regardless of what your skin tone may be because everybody is fair game. It reminds me of the Marine Corps in that way. Incidentally both of those environments were places where people got along the best of all work environments I’ve been in. HR people are pretty worthless most of the time.boyyourself wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 6:38 pmCole Younger wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 5:43 pm@boyyourself, Coca Cola and Miller-Coors telling their employees to act “less white” surpasses all recent permutations of political stupidity IMO.
Yeah I'm gonna file that under the dumbest and one of the most racist things that I've ever heard, for now. Good entertainment though.
A single shot rifle and a one eyed dog.
-
- Posts: 3989
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 6:34 pm
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
@beantownbubba, I don’t know why this leads you to think we just can’t talk about this stuff. That’s not how I feel at all. In the end all I’m saying is, trust me. There are times you’ve posted things that had me thinking, “Is he serious? He can’t be serious.” But I have to take into account that we live in different worlds come from very different places and at the very least, I know you are a quality person so either you’re having a bad day, I’m misunderstanding you, or something about that particular subject has just rubbed you the wrong way and that’s what I’m seeing. I never have had the thought, “Well he’s not who I thought he was.” The one and only time I’ve ever thought, “Ok this pisses me off.” when reading anything you’ve posted was what I mentioned here and it really isn’t a big deal. I’m over it. So I really did a bunch of typing for no reason. It ain’t the first time though. Probably won’t be the last.
A single shot rifle and a one eyed dog.
-
- Posts: 957
- Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2010 9:38 pm
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
boyyourself wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:01 pmThe story of multi nationals trying to control minds is as old as multi nationals.
Coca Cola started the "dont litter" campaign back in the day, with the crying Indian. Why? Because it was cheaper for them to make new bottles than buy back used ones for five cents, thus putting the ownice on you-----even though they're the assholes cranking out millions of tons of waste. All so everyone can have have that liquid sugar straight to the dome. Sounds like an ecological disaster with a slice of pandemic waiting to happen. Ironically now I'm hearing we are running out of glass viles for vaccines. Where are they ending up? And Where do more come from? The earth I suppose. Oh well, it's your civic duty not to litter and get a vaccine and whatnot.
Maybe your buddy could show up to work wearing black face?
-
- Posts: 21837
- Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2010 10:52 am
- Location: Trying to stay focused on the righteous path
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
As you know, I'm speaking second hand only, but it is my strong impression backed up by some data and a lot of anecdotal evidence that since its integration the military has been perhaps the greatest force for racial equality in this country. It makes intuitive sense because in the military you get down to what really matters pretty fast whether it's who you want in the foxhole with you or we damn well better cooperate and figure out how to work together or somebody (or somebodies) is gonna die. Also, the nature of the beast does not really allow for thin skins. Forcing people to sink or swim based only on their performance sounds like a great principle but it is really difficult to apply in real life. I think the military does it about as well as it's been done in this country.Cole Younger wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:05 pmIncidentally both of those environments were places where people got along the best of all work environments I’ve been in.
PS I don't know how the trucking part fits into this equation but perhaps you have some thoughts on the subject?
All opinions and commentary in my posts are solely my own and are made in my personal capacity.
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
I want to have your baby.Cole Younger wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:05 pmA buddy of mine works at Miller-Coors and showed me the video they had to watch. I cracked up watching it but if I was forced to watch something like that at my job with management putting pressure on us to actually give horse shit like that a serious thought I guess I would have a decision to make. I know myself and I would probably get booted or put on suspension for asking, “So if we have to act less white, are we supposed to act more black? Hispanic? Asian? What are y’all shooting for? Which race/nationality is ok?”. Luckily, doing what I do for a living there is none of this kind of insanity and you had better leave your feelings in the truck regardless of what your skin tone may be because everybody is fair game. It reminds me of the Marine Corps in that way. Incidentally both of those environments were places where people got along the best of all work environments I’ve been in. HR people are pretty worthless most of the time.boyyourself wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 6:38 pmCole Younger wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 5:43 pm@boyyourself, Coca Cola and Miller-Coors telling their employees to act “less white” surpasses all recent permutations of political stupidity IMO.
Yeah I'm gonna file that under the dumbest and one of the most racist things that I've ever heard, for now. Good entertainment though.
Now it's dark.
-
- Posts: 287
- Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:53 am
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
A truth universally accepted I think.
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
I believe the truck is what they use to get to work.beantownbubba wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 8:13 pm
PS I don't know how the trucking part fits into this equation but perhaps you have some thoughts on the subject?
Don't hurt people, and don't take their stuff.
-
- Posts: 3989
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 6:34 pm
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
Yep. If you want to see radically different kinds of people come to not only accept each other but willing to actually die for each other there it is. Black, white, Hispanic,Asian, white people from the city, white people from the country, north and south and wherever. It doesn’t match some pointy headed HR asshole’s vision of equality and tolerance but if you want to see what it really looks like when people put bullshit aside and are real with each other, there it is. And people give each other SHIT and are merciless about it. It’s like once it’s out in the open it’s no big deal. You know how many times I was called stuff like “Jethro” and “hillbilly”? A lot. Racially tinged jokes were common place too. It ain’t for the faint of heart. I think that’s why it works. The faint of heart aren’t there so you don’t get the HR department forced empathy bullshit. People come to accept differences etc naturally. Now I don’t want to white wash it. There are fights too. Like actual fights. Not arguments. But it’s understood that after it’s over you don’t have to be best friends but better learn to deal with each other. It’s always squashed after that though.beantownbubba wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 8:13 pmAs you know, I'm speaking second hand only, but it is my strong impression backed up by some data and a lot of anecdotal evidence that since its integration the military has been perhaps the greatest force for racial equality in this country. It makes intuitive sense because in the military you get down to what really matters pretty fast whether it's who you want in the foxhole with you or we damn well better cooperate and figure out how to work together or somebody (or somebodies) is gonna die. Also, the nature of the beast does not really allow for thin skins. Forcing people to sink or swim based only on their performance sounds like a great principle but it is really difficult to apply in real life. I think the military does it about as well as it's been done in this country.Cole Younger wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:05 pmIncidentally both of those environments were places where people got along the best of all work environments I’ve been in.
PS I don't know how the trucking part fits into this equation but perhaps you have some thoughts on the subject?
You lost me at trucking. I think I might have messed you up with the comment about leaving your feelings in the truck. I
just said that because most folks on my job drive trucks as their vehicle. I’m not a truck driver I’m an iron worker. Steele construction. Welding, walking beams, torch cutting, rigging with a crane etc. I don’t know all the ins and outs of their commonalities but I know they are similar in that it ain’t for the faint of heart so the faint of heart aren’t there. It’s rough ass work. I guess without thinking about it too much I’d say in both instances you face a good deal of physical hardship and both occupations are dangerous and require a certain amount of physical courage and intestinal fortitude. For these and other reasons there is just nobody around who gets hung up on petty shit and if anyone tried that they would get run off. Also, there is a lot of ball busting but everyone knows where the line is. A fist fight is a very real possibility in this occupation if you decide to try and throw your weight around.
I think people have it too easy in this country for the most part and the average person doesn’t face a whole lot of adversity so they fixate on stupid shit.
I’m also not one of those military guys who thinks everybody should do a few years in the military. I think that’s a fucking horrible idea for a few different reasons.
A single shot rifle and a one eyed dog.
-
- Posts: 3989
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 6:34 pm
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
Flea wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 8:18 pmI want to have your baby.Cole Younger wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 7:05 pmA buddy of mine works at Miller-Coors and showed me the video they had to watch. I cracked up watching it but if I was forced to watch something like that at my job with management putting pressure on us to actually give horse shit like that a serious thought I guess I would have a decision to make. I know myself and I would probably get booted or put on suspension for asking, “So if we have to act less white, are we supposed to act more black? Hispanic? Asian? What are y’all shooting for? Which race/nationality is ok?”. Luckily, doing what I do for a living there is none of this kind of insanity and you had better leave your feelings in the truck regardless of what your skin tone may be because everybody is fair game. It reminds me of the Marine Corps in that way. Incidentally both of those environments were places where people got along the best of all work environments I’ve been in. HR people are pretty worthless most of the time.boyyourself wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 6:38 pm
Yeah I'm gonna file that under the dumbest and one of the most racist things that I've ever heard, for now. Good entertainment though.
A single shot rifle and a one eyed dog.
-
- Posts: 7895
- Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 9:51 am
- Location: Little Rock, Arkansaw
- Contact:
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
I understand it and agree with it. Remember this discussion?beantownbubba wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 6:36 pmYou say "police committing acts of violence against someone is wrong all the time." I don't understand how you can believe that and I am disturbed that believing that provides a basis from which you can conclude that the Capitol killing and the George Floyd murder are equivalent. To me it's like we're not even talking about the same subject.
It's not murder, but it's still wrong if it's self-defense. It's a killing you may be forgiven--should be forgiven, most likely--but it's still killing and it's still wrong. It may be the least wrong choice you have. It may be the rightest thing you can do. It's still wrong and it's still on your head. Even if you're right.Tony Hendra wrote:Murder is not a mission or a career calling or a career. If you went to West Point or the Air Force Academy to get a degree in it, it's still murder. All the fancy words your superiors come up with-retaliation, extreme prejudice, overwhelming force, collateral damage, smart this, and pinpoint that-cannot alter the fact that all these words mean murder.
Wearing a uniform does not stop killing from being murder, killing for your country does not stop it from being murder. Clicking on an icon a thousand miles away does not stop it from being murder. Sending a command to a robot does not stop it from being murder. If your sergeant tells you to do it, it's murder; if you are told by your officer to tell an enlisted man to do it, all three of you commit murder. It's murder if a court absolves you of all wrongdoing. It's murder if a man of God blesses the weapon you murder with. It's murder if you vote for someone who tells others to murder in your name. It's murder if the one you murder has murdered.
All violence is wrong, even when it's the best possible choice. You have to bear the wrongness if you want not to bear the guilt of inaction. Which is a fucked-up choice but is at least a choice.
John A knows what he's talking about, because John A words stupid things beautifully, which is at least as bad and most likely worse than you, brother.
The sooner we put those assholes in the grave&piss on the dirt above it, the better off we'll be
-
- Posts: 7895
- Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 9:51 am
- Location: Little Rock, Arkansaw
- Contact:
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
So I had something to say:
INSURRECTILE DYSFUNCTION AND SELF-TERRORISM: A HOW-NOT-TO STORY
INSURRECTILE DYSFUNCTION AND SELF-TERRORISM: A HOW-NOT-TO STORY
Read the rest at the link.So the planned catastrophe of March 4 did not come to pass.
I'm not surprised. Those who are out to kill democracy and its supporters by any means availble are an extremely small minority, empowered beyond their actual numbers by their ability to kill and destroy. Which is all they got--beyond that, they have nothing.
The sooner we put those assholes in the grave&piss on the dirt above it, the better off we'll be
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
Interesting discussion to have here regarding the draft, and I admittedly have very mixed feelings - but I often wonder if US wartime excursions would diminish rapidly if we had either a draft lottery or compulsory military/public service for every 18 to 21 year old WITHOUT EXCEPTION.Cole Younger wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 9:30 pm
I’m also not one of those military guys who thinks everybody should do a few years in the military. I think that’s a fucking horrible idea for a few different reasons.
On the other hand, I could never function well in a military setting. I can get along with most anyone, I can function as part of a unit and do a bang-up job for all - but I have this problem with authority that would keep me in hot water.
Now it's dark.
- tinnitus photography
- Posts: 7274
- Joined: Mon Apr 26, 2010 6:49 pm
- Contact:
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
i would agree with this, and have a civil service component for those who don't want military service... like habitats for humanity or similar.Flea wrote: ↑Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:06 pmInteresting discussion to have here regarding the draft, and I admittedly have very mixed feelings - but I often wonder if US wartime excursions would diminish rapidly if we had either a draft lottery or compulsory military/public service for every 18 to 21 year old WITHOUT EXCEPTION.Cole Younger wrote: ↑Thu Mar 04, 2021 9:30 pm
I’m also not one of those military guys who thinks everybody should do a few years in the military. I think that’s a fucking horrible idea for a few different reasons.
On the other hand, I could never function well in a military setting. I can get along with most anyone, I can function as part of a unit and do a bang-up job for all - but I have this problem with authority that would keep me in hot water.
-
- Posts: 21837
- Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2010 10:52 am
- Location: Trying to stay focused on the righteous path
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
National service (a much broader concept than "just" military service) seems like a great idea to me. While I wonder about its constitutionality, I figure that if the draft is constitutional (which it is, though I've never really thought about the whys and wherefores), national service should be too.
All opinions and commentary in my posts are solely my own and are made in my personal capacity.
-
- Posts: 21837
- Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2010 10:52 am
- Location: Trying to stay focused on the righteous path
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
So let's say you propose a $1.9 trillion economic relief & stimulus package. Let's say that in the legislative process the package gets whittled down a few billion here, a few billion there. How is the final package still worth $1.9 trillion? This seems to be the unquestioned number but I haven't seen anything about if or why it stands up.
All opinions and commentary in my posts are solely my own and are made in my personal capacity.
-
- Posts: 287
- Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:53 am
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
I wonder how many people in the military would actually like to see National Service? Suspect they'd rather do without having to serve alongside guys who don't really want to be there and can't wait to get to the end of it.
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
305 Engine wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 6:44 amI wonder how many people in the military would actually like to see National Service? Suspect they'd rather do without having to serve alongside guys who don't really want to be there and can't wait to get to the end of it.
Are there not military who don’t want to be there and can’t wait to get to the end?
And I knew when I woke up Rock N Roll would be here forever
-
- Posts: 287
- Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:53 am
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
I imagine there are plenty of people who join because they dont see much other option. That seems a bit different to literally not giving someone an option. The volunteer who really needs that job will probably be a better soldier than a conscript.Zip City wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 8:48 am305 Engine wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 6:44 amI wonder how many people in the military would actually like to see National Service? Suspect they'd rather do without having to serve alongside guys who don't really want to be there and can't wait to get to the end of it.
Are there not military who don’t want to be there and can’t wait to get to the end?
Then you've the question of training someone up when they will only be there a year or so. How much training will they get? How useful can they be? Are there better ways of using the resources put into constantly training an ever changing group of kids pressed into service? That would all apply to any service the kids go into not just the military.
But I get that people like the national service idea because it gives people experience and responsibility. I see the logic but there are probably ways of giving young people that education which dont involve the military (or Red Cross, or the Fire Service or....?) having to find ways to use conscripts.
-
- Posts: 21837
- Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2010 10:52 am
- Location: Trying to stay focused on the righteous path
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
This may be a case of 2 countries separated by a common language, 305, but I don't understand your comments.305 Engine wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 9:04 amI imagine there are plenty of people who join because they dont see much other option. That seems a bit different to literally not giving someone an option. The volunteer who really needs that job will probably be a better soldier than a conscript.Zip City wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 8:48 am305 Engine wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 6:44 amI wonder how many people in the military would actually like to see National Service? Suspect they'd rather do without having to serve alongside guys who don't really want to be there and can't wait to get to the end of it.
Are there not military who don’t want to be there and can’t wait to get to the end?
Then you've the question of training someone up when they will only be there a year or so. How much training will they get? How useful can they be? Are there better ways of using the resources put into constantly training an ever changing group of kids pressed into service? That would all apply to any service the kids go into not just the military.
But I get that people like the national service idea because it gives people experience and responsibility. I see the logic but there are probably ways of giving young people that education which dont involve the military (or Red Cross, or the Fire Service or....?) having to find ways to use conscripts.
Of the 3 people to mention national service, 1 specifically mentioned military service and the other 2 both specifically said they were thinking about a broader type of service. I think that in the UK "national service" may refer specifically to military service, but I take national service to mean a year (perhaps 2 for more difficult to learn or popular options) of service to the country either voluntarily w/ a strong societal push/expectation or mandatory w/ very, very few exceptions, to generally occur after the common age for graduating HS, with a multi-year window to allow for some flexibility. Service would obviously include the military, might include things like the Peace Corps or AmeriCorps and at least in my version would include modern equivalents of the Depression era Civilian Conservation Corps and the Works Project Administration (let me know if you need some detail on those). Those programs are generally considered to have been very successful. Most national service proposals I've seen floated contemplate that at least some portion of the participants would be involved in projects to improve infrastructure. Examples might include organizations like Habitat for Humanity and the Peace Corps. As with many military services (see below) 1 to 2 years of service seems to be more than adequate to learn useful skills and contribute something useful to the country. Specifically with respect to military service, compulsory service allows for quicker and more effective mobilization in times of war or other emergency.
In any case, we have a lot of laboratory testing grounds. 28 seems to be the commonly accepted number of countries with some version of compulsory military service. While the list includes the bad actors one might expect like Myanmar, it also includes countries that perceive themselves under constant threat like Israel, North Korea and South Korea and countries that are not so easily classifiable like Switzerland, Denmark and Norway. The programs vary in many ways from time of service to whether females are included to the number and type of exemptions, but all fit broadly into the definition of "compulsory military service." I'm sure the experiences vary by country and type of program but my take away is that the potential problems you mention are easily or at least regularly surmounted. I note that even Israel allows alternative "national service" for conscientious objectors.
In looking into this, I found this wonderful quote from Plutarch from about the year 100 quoting a Roman general from about the 5th century BCE (IOW a freaking long time ago):
"With the politic design of preventing intestine broils by employment abroad, and in the hope that when rich as well as poor, plebeians and patricians, should be mingled again in the same army and in the same camp, and engage in one common service for the public, it would mutually dispose them to reconciliation and friendship."
All opinions and commentary in my posts are solely my own and are made in my personal capacity.
-
- Posts: 287
- Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:53 am
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
Yes understood, thats why I referred to the Red Cross and the Fire Service. As potential alternative kinds of national service.beantownbubba wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 1:11 pmThis may be a case of 2 countries separated by a common language, 305, but I don't understand your comments.305 Engine wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 9:04 amI imagine there are plenty of people who join because they dont see much other option. That seems a bit different to literally not giving someone an option. The volunteer who really needs that job will probably be a better soldier than a conscript.
Then you've the question of training someone up when they will only be there a year or so. How much training will they get? How useful can they be? Are there better ways of using the resources put into constantly training an ever changing group of kids pressed into service? That would all apply to any service the kids go into not just the military.
But I get that people like the national service idea because it gives people experience and responsibility. I see the logic but there are probably ways of giving young people that education which dont involve the military (or Red Cross, or the Fire Service or....?) having to find ways to use conscripts.
Of the 3 people to mention national service, 1 specifically mentioned military service and the other 2 both specifically said they were thinking about a broader type of service. I think that in the UK "national service" may refer specifically to military service, but I take national service to mean a year (perhaps 2 for more difficult to learn or popular options) of service to the country either voluntarily w/ a strong societal push/expectation or mandatory w/ very, very few exceptions, to generally occur after the common age for graduating HS, with a multi-year window to allow for some flexibility. Service would obviously include the military, might include things like the Peace Corps or AmeriCorps and at least in my version would include modern equivalents of the Depression era Civilian Conservation Corps and the Works Project Administration (let me know if you need some detail on those). Those programs are generally considered to have been very successful. Most national service proposals I've seen floated contemplate that at least some portion of the participants would be involved in projects to improve infrastructure. Examples might include organizations like Habitat for Humanity and the Peace Corps. As with many military services (see below) 1 to 2 years of service seems to be more than adequate to learn useful skills and contribute something useful to the country. Specifically with respect to military service, compulsory service allows for quicker and more effective mobilization in times of war or other emergency.
In any case, we have a lot of laboratory testing grounds. 28 seems to be the commonly accepted number of countries with some version of compulsory military service. While the list includes the bad actors one might expect like Myanmar, it also includes countries that perceive themselves under constant threat like Israel, North Korea and South Korea and countries that are not so easily classifiable like Switzerland, Denmark and Norway. The programs vary in many ways from time of service to whether females are included to the number and type of exemptions, but all fit broadly into the definition of "compulsory military service." I'm sure the experiences vary by country and type of program but my take away is that the potential problems you mention are easily or at least regularly surmounted. I note that even Israel allows alternative "national service" for conscientious objectors.
In looking into this, I found this wonderful quote from Plutarch from about the year 100 quoting a Roman general from about the 5th century BCE (IOW a freaking long time ago):
"With the politic design of preventing intestine broils by employment abroad, and in the hope that when rich as well as poor, plebeians and patricians, should be mingled again in the same army and in the same camp, and engage in one common service for the public, it would mutually dispose them to reconciliation and friendship."
I'm not sold on the "national service as education" angle.
The argument that a service may benefit from a wider range of people being involved, and develop closer links with the people it's meant to represent is a different one. I'm more sold on that angle. It's basically why Germany ran it for so long.
Ultimately when I was 18 I'd have hated having to do this, so I'm unlikely to ever suggest it for anyone else!
-
- Posts: 21837
- Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2010 10:52 am
- Location: Trying to stay focused on the righteous path
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
Yeah I would have hated it too and would have complained about it long and loud. But I wish now that the requirement existed and that I had done my bit.
All opinions and commentary in my posts are solely my own and are made in my personal capacity.
-
- Posts: 7895
- Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 9:51 am
- Location: Little Rock, Arkansaw
- Contact:
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
It's a rare CEO I'd let watch my child, but they do exist. Case in point:
The End of Silicon Valley as We Know It?
Four ways the party may be coming to an end
So much in here to chew on! If you need a teaser, here is it:
The End of Silicon Valley as We Know It?
Four ways the party may be coming to an end
So much in here to chew on! If you need a teaser, here is it:
And if you'd like a big old bite:In the case of social media platforms, manipulation of users for profit has frayed the fabric of democracy and the respect for truth. Silicon Valley, which once harnessed the collective intelligence of its users, now uses its deep knowledge of its users to “trade against them.”
I disagree with Tim about a lot--some of which is in this piece--and he's worth reading closely enough to disagree with.The notion of maximizing profit is so ingrained in our society that in 2014, when Facebook researchers published a paper called “Experimental Evidence of Massive-Scale Emotional Contagion Through Social Networks,” the response was swift and savage. It was considered a terrible breach of research ethics to test whether the mix of stories in the Facebook news feed made its readers happier or sadder. The reaction was particularly striking because no one seemed to notice that Silicon Valley explicitly celebrates and teaches its entrepreneurs how to manipulate the emotional state of users, calling it “growth hacking” or “A/B testing” or “creating habit-forming products.” No one complains about these experiments. It’s considered a best practice to experiment on your customers as long as it is in pursuit of growth and profits.
Because the cost of those experiments is so low—it’s a sunk cost of the business—experimental mistakes and unforeseen consequences are only to be expected. They become a new class of externality little considered by economists and regulators.
In retrospect, some formal experimentation on emotional contagion and reflection on its implications would have been a good idea. Instead, we continue to run global-scale unsupervised experiments on the power of social media to spread negative emotional contagion for profit, while any effort by the platforms to influence their users in positive directions is still considered by many to be inappropriate intervention, or is abandoned because it might reduce user activity and growth.
For example, during the 2020 US presidential election, Facebook engineers reportedly trained a machine learning algorithm to recognize posts that their users would consider “bad for the world,” but the company found that showing fewer of them reduced the number of user sessions and thus, presumably revenue and profits. So they retrained the algorithm to find the point where “bad for the world” posts were reduced but not by so much that they impacted user sessions. Other changes to optimize for “news ecosystem quality” were put in place for a few weeks leading up to the election, but reversed thereafter.
“Shareholder value” is so ingrained in corporate governance that a special class of corporation, “the public benefit corporation,” has been defined to protect companies that are managed to take other considerations than profit into account. All “normal” companies are expected to treat employees, the environment, and society as costs to be minimized, avoided, or eliminated.
The sooner we put those assholes in the grave&piss on the dirt above it, the better off we'll be
-
- Posts: 3989
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 6:34 pm
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
Yes.Zip City wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 8:48 am305 Engine wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 6:44 amI wonder how many people in the military would actually like to see National Service? Suspect they'd rather do without having to serve alongside guys who don't really want to be there and can't wait to get to the end of it.
Are there not military who don’t want to be there and can’t wait to get to the end? :
A single shot rifle and a one eyed dog.
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
I thought so, but didn’t want to be presumptuousCole Younger wrote: ↑Thu Mar 11, 2021 6:30 pmYes.Zip City wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 8:48 am305 Engine wrote: ↑Tue Mar 09, 2021 6:44 amI wonder how many people in the military would actually like to see National Service? Suspect they'd rather do without having to serve alongside guys who don't really want to be there and can't wait to get to the end of it.
Are there not military who don’t want to be there and can’t wait to get to the end? :
And I knew when I woke up Rock N Roll would be here forever
-
- Posts: 3989
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2011 6:34 pm
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
Reckon what’s going to happen with ol Andy Cuomo? I don’t believe much of anything will.
A single shot rifle and a one eyed dog.
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
Probably not, though something should. Where there’s smoke there’s usually fireCole Younger wrote: ↑Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:26 amReckon what’s going to happen with ol Andy Cuomo? I don’t believe much of anything will.
And I knew when I woke up Rock N Roll would be here forever
-
- Posts: 21837
- Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2010 10:52 am
- Location: Trying to stay focused on the righteous path
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
What should happen to him?Cole Younger wrote: ↑Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:26 amReckon what’s going to happen with ol Andy Cuomo? I don’t believe much of anything will.
All opinions and commentary in my posts are solely my own and are made in my personal capacity.
-
- Posts: 21837
- Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2010 10:52 am
- Location: Trying to stay focused on the righteous path
Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit
Oh for the days if innocent until proven guilty. Not that they ever really existed but back in the day at least some people some of the time thought the concept ought to at least get lip service. I can't remember the last time I heard it (except when I've used it myself).Zip City wrote: ↑Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:46 amProbably not, though something should. Where there’s smoke there’s usually fireCole Younger wrote: ↑Sat Mar 13, 2021 10:26 amReckon what’s going to happen with ol Andy Cuomo? I don’t believe much of anything will.
All opinions and commentary in my posts are solely my own and are made in my personal capacity.