Coronavirus - COVID-19

[Mundane Mayhem]

If you don’t dispute that it’s safe and effective, then why not take it? Just so you can say you didn’t do what the government “told” you to?

And no, we are not going to reach herd immunity one way or the other. It’s a question as to whether we get there at all, due in large part to, and I mean no offense, people like you.

Is that really why you think I’m not taking it? To make a fake tough guy stance?
Your inquiries are appreciated but that’s just an annoying assumption.

Why do YOU want me to take this vaccine?

A fair question that I'll try to answer succinctly. I am not an expert, but I do a fair bit of reading on this due to it turning the world upside down over the past year.

We may have a limited window to establish herd immunity and arrest the spread of the virus. As you know, viruses evolve rapidly when they are allowed to circulate. So if you happen to get infected and then incubate a variant that somehow evades our existing vaccines, then you might have contributed to rendering hundreds of millions of people's vaccinations moot. Which, selfishly, I would be a little salty about.

That being said, I'm a young vegetarian who is unlikely to be at high risk of suffering serious disease or dying. Although the more we learn about the long-haul symptoms, possible mental health effects, etc., the more uncertain I am that that is necessarily the benchmark, but I digress. So also selfishly, if we don't quash the spread of the virus, my DBT shows and baseball games and such are in jeopardy if we go back into lockdown mode. You might say "then let's just not go back into lockdown," but that isn't in my control and I don't want the responsibility for deciding how many deaths we can accept by staying open.

Here's the short answer: herd immunity is the goal, and you and I are part of the same herd. Even more so than some others: we live in the same state. I love recreating in your neck of the woods. Our paths may cross there, or at a DBT show in the near future.

Frankly, a point in your column is that even if we achieve it here, the rest of the world is largely running behind and might incubate that same variant. But that's another conversation for another day that involves phrases like "vaccine apartheid" and "intellectual property waivers."

[boyyourself]

So instead of experiencing a miraculous renaissance, it could still be nighttime dark at noon in Pittsburgh and people would be still be dying at 50 in large numbers?

So instead of traffic lights and stop signs we'd have... what, exactly? And if some private entrepreneurs built their own traffic controlled streets, how would they enforce compliance? But think of all the money we'd save not having to pay to ride bumper cars at the fair yet still having all the excitement every day.

No seatbelts, no crashworthiness standards at all. But no worries because just like airplane manufacturers, car manufacturers would have incentives to make safe products except even with those incentives AND significant regulation, Boeing fucks up royally once every few years and we know how safe and reliable cars were before Ralph Nader wrote that book, right?

Leaded gasoline would make a huge comeback along w/ lead paint, which I guess is a good thing because babies do find those paint chips to be delicious

No police and no criminal law so everyone would be responsible for enforcing their own sense of justice using their own level of proof to decide who to shoot. Rich people would no doubt pay for their own police forces, which unconstrained by either law or policy could shoot whoever they wanted whenever they wanted. I feel safer already.

No way to enforce civil judgments even if private courts purported to decide cases, so more private enforcement leading to a situation somewhere between complete lack of enforceability and total chaos

Housing left solely to market forces so every city and town would have its own tent city if they're lucky and cardboard shacks if they weren't, just like Soweto and the favellas in Rio. And no zoning of course so good luck stopping that coal mine on the property next door and say goodbye to sunny summer barbecues in your backyard because your neighbor decided your neighborhood was an excellent spot to build a 30 or 50 story building.

Public transportation left to the private market which means there would be no public transportation which means large swaths of the population would be trapped where they live with no way to get to jobs even if they wanted to so even favellas would be a step up from the kinds of ghettoes that would ensue

Anybody and everybody could call themselves a doctor or a lawyer or a native american chief. Of course the better practitioners would form private associations to certify standards and we all know how tough professionals are on themselves. And I wonder what would stop anyone from hanging a shingle with their own seal of approval which looks just like the one the AMA or ABA issue?

Without patent and copyright protection, who would risk investment in innovation? The pace of innovation would slow to that of the 1600's, and we'd still be picking cotton by hand and shitting in outhouses. Or the streets.

We can all experience the joys of living in terror of polio and smallpox and the excitement of playing thalidomide roulette every time we swallow a pill or give one to our children

Presumably people would pay privately for fire insurance but if one's neighbor chooses to gamble, your house goes up along with theirs

Education would be left to private industry meaning, what?, 20, 30 or 50 percent of the population illiterate? And who knows what the other 50% would be taught? I guess we should all be relieved to know that crazy stuff like evolution would no longer be taught in large swaths of the country.

Instead of the occasional Great Recession we could have recurring depressions caused by market manipulations just like the 1870's, At least they would be predictable.

But wait. We wouldn't even have currency so who knows what the economy would look like. Some form of barter economy I guess so we can all party like its 1499.

We wouldn't have a clue about what's in our food, except we can be virtually certain it would include mouse droppings, pieces of rat, human snot and a bunch of other delicacies. Or of course we could all grow and make our own food so we could have an economy just like the Middle Ages

It would be fun to walk on Lake Erie, though.

I think he was saying he doesn’t want to be pushed.(not speaking for Rod). But that’s what he said. I wouldn’t take that to mean we don’t need leadership and organization.
And like anything shouldn’t we see each case differently? Or at least each region differently?
How can something like a corona vaccine be touted as a miracle in a place like San Miguel county which is still sitting on zero deaths.
So I guess we are doing perfectly. And why is that? Can’t credit the vaxx. Yet we are supposed to get jabbed to improve on perfect?
Who exactly would we be protecting?
What’s the science behind vaccinating for something that has killed zero people?
And no way in hell this community can claim that the zero death number is a testament to everyone locking down and not socializing and spreading it around. That’s not what happened.

Yet somehow it’s a miracle. Or that if I don’t get it I will pay a price. Imagine the orange clown saying that. Seems pretty pushy to me. And what would the price be to jamming a needle into something that ain’t broke? Don’t know. Not gonna find out.

Dude, its great that your county has zero deaths. And I'm not smart enough to know why your county has done so well compared to the norm. I suspect it has something to do with living in a sparsely populated region and your earlier points about healthy lifestyle, eating habits., etc. But you live in a county with 8,000 people, so that is not a particularly large sample; there are literally ten times as many people in my zip code alone. And COVID has been pretty real here. One of my daughter's 9th grade classmates lost both of her parents to COVID last month. Unfortunately, we can't go back in time and encourage/convince people to live healthier lifestyles so that this illness would not have had the impact that it has had in many, many communities. Pretty sure the point of the vaccine is to try to prevent the illness as much as possible going forward and getting us back to "normal". So let's deal with the cards we have been dealt and get people to get the freaking vaccine.

Your neighboring county Montrose, which i assume has similar characteristics to your county, had had 58 deaths (population of 40,000). Next to that is Mesa county, with 222 deaths among 150,000. What are they doing differently from your county?

What characteristics do you think San Miguel county and Montrose county share? Even less similar is Mesa county. And are you saying 8000 people is too small a sample size so lifestyle observations don’t factor in? That’s silly.
Telluride is literally based on recreation and sits at 8750 above sea level. There’s almost no one one here that’s overweight. You almost literally can’t be because of how difficult it is just to breath. Almost everyone is fit here and into outdoor activities. But you’re saying that’s to small a sample size to put a microscope on a community like that with zero deaths.......as if it’s coincidence?

You drive just 65 miles down the road and loose 3000 ft of elevation to Montrose it’s an alternate universe. You may as well be in Texas. I Not that there isn’t recreation. Tons of boating and biking and fishing. But it’s not even close to being the same as here as far as overall community lifestyle.

And even further down and way different is Grand junction which is actually Mecca for recreation with climbing mountain biking boating etc. but also has ag and oil industry there and more people.


See if you can answer this with a quick search......what was the average age of all the deaths you mentioned?
What were pre existing conditions?
Any children?
What were the death reporting standards of each hospital?

And again I thought the point of the vaccine was so that they you’re safe. So why do you need me to get it? I’m not going to walk into a nursing home and sneeze on anyone’s grandma.

[Mundane Mayhem]

Sorry, a few more.

3) What, specifically, is your hesitation with these particular vaccines? The accelerated timeline on which they were developed and trialed? The relatively novel technology used in the mRNA vaccines? How about J&J? The lack of data on long-term effects? If so, at what time horizon does that hesitation fade away?

4) Without asking you to divulge personal medical information, given your age and the country you live in, you were very probably vaccinated as a child against a large number of pathogens. Assuming this is the case, would you make different choices for your infant/toddler self, given the opportunity? If yes, which vaccines would you still receive, and which would you forgo? Why?

I’m not nearly educated on vaccines to answer.
If I was having a kid today I’d look into it.

Is it about saving lives? That’s my question.
And if it was, where’s the driving narrative on how to not be high risk? Nowhere. Because it’s not about saving lives.
Hell all the preventions and remedies to Covid all somehow fly in the face of prevailing narratives.
Vitamin D is crucial yet we aren’t encouraged to go outside.
Zinc is crucial yet where’s the info on how to get it naturally through grass fed beef or bison?
Nowhere. It’s all about plant based propaganda.
HCQ was used all over the world to minimize Covid symptoms yet the big bad clown touted it so it got cancelled. Because science and saving lives and whatnot.
I think it’s a dangerous way to go about things if we are truly concerned about the long term
Wellness of our population. Which politicians and pharma are not. Is that news?
So I just don’t think it’s that crazy of a notion to think that the best thing you can do is take charge of your own health. It’s just an opinion.
It doesn’t mean I’m anti vaxx.

I don't understand why you seem to be treating it as an either/or rather than a both/and. You probably have good points about a more holistic view of wellness. But since you say you aren't anti-vaxx, why not do both? We can have workshops about Zinc and Vitamin D once we can safely gather in large groups again--thanks to vaccines.

[Mundane Mayhem]

And again I thought the point of the vaccine was so that they you’re safe. So why do you need me to get it? I’m not going to walk into a nursing home and sneeze on anyone’s grandma.

You've mentioned herd immunity in this thread, but maybe there's a disconnect as to how we're defining it. Can you explain what "herd immunity" means, as you understand it?

[boyyourself]

Sorry, a few more.

3) What, specifically, is your hesitation with these particular vaccines? The accelerated timeline on which they were developed and trialed? The relatively novel technology used in the mRNA vaccines? How about J&J? The lack of data on long-term effects? If so, at what time horizon does that hesitation fade away?

4) Without asking you to divulge personal medical information, given your age and the country you live in, you were very probably vaccinated as a child against a large number of pathogens. Assuming this is the case, would you make different choices for your infant/toddler self, given the opportunity? If yes, which vaccines would you still receive, and which would you forgo? Why?

I’m not nearly educated on vaccines to answer.
If I was having a kid today I’d look into it.

Is it about saving lives? That’s my question.
And if it was, where’s the driving narrative on how to not be high risk? Nowhere. Because it’s not about saving lives.
Hell all the preventions and remedies to Covid all somehow fly in the face of prevailing narratives.
Vitamin D is crucial yet we aren’t encouraged to go outside.
Zinc is crucial yet where’s the info on how to get it naturally through grass fed beef or bison?
Nowhere. It’s all about plant based propaganda.
HCQ was used all over the world to minimize Covid symptoms yet the big bad clown touted it so it got cancelled. Because science and saving lives and whatnot.
I think it’s a dangerous way to go about things if we are truly concerned about the long term
Wellness of our population. Which politicians and pharma are not. Is that news?
So I just don’t think it’s that crazy of a notion to think that the best thing you can do is take charge of your own health. It’s just an opinion.
It doesn’t mean I’m anti vaxx.

I don't understand why you seem to be treating it as an either/or rather than a both/and. You probably have good points about a more holistic view of wellness. But since you say you aren't anti-vaxx, why not do both? We can have workshops about Zinc and Vitamin D once we can safely gather in large groups again--thanks to vaccines.

I’m not saying we can’t do both.
But the reality is not everyone is gonna get this vaxx. It seems like a futile notion to think that they are or to shake a fist at people and wonder what’s wrong with them. This isn’t dealing with reality. And I can’t technically exposing herd immunity but think we all kind of agree on what the jist of it is and it seems we are headed that way.
Again I don’t get why you wouldn’t feel protected and safe if you have been vaccinated. So what is the point in worrying about what others do?

[Zip City]

We’re not going to explain it to you again. We’ve done so several times and you keep ignoring it and looping back to your same talking points.

[pearlbeer]

I’m not nearly educated on vaccines to answer.
If I was having a kid today I’d look into it.

Is it about saving lives? That’s my question.
And if it was, where’s the driving narrative on how to not be high risk? Nowhere. Because it’s not about saving lives.
Hell all the preventions and remedies to Covid all somehow fly in the face of prevailing narratives.
Vitamin D is crucial yet we aren’t encouraged to go outside.
Zinc is crucial yet where’s the info on how to get it naturally through grass fed beef or bison?
Nowhere. It’s all about plant based propaganda.
HCQ was used all over the world to minimize Covid symptoms yet the big bad clown touted it so it got cancelled. Because science and saving lives and whatnot.
I think it’s a dangerous way to go about things if we are truly concerned about the long term
Wellness of our population. Which politicians and pharma are not. Is that news?
So I just don’t think it’s that crazy of a notion to think that the best thing you can do is take charge of your own health. It’s just an opinion.
It doesn’t mean I’m anti vaxx.

I don't understand why you seem to be treating it as an either/or rather than a both/and. You probably have good points about a more holistic view of wellness. But since you say you aren't anti-vaxx, why not do both? We can have workshops about Zinc and Vitamin D once we can safely gather in large groups again--thanks to vaccines.

I’m not saying we can’t do both.
But the reality is not everyone is gonna get this vaxx. It seems like a futile notion to think that they are or to shake a fist at people and wonder what’s wrong with them. This isn’t dealing with reality. And I can’t technically exposing herd immunity but think we all kind of agree on what the jist of it is and it seems we are headed that way.
Again I don’t get why you wouldn’t feel protected and safe if you have been vaccinated. So what is the point in worrying about what others do?

I'll answer this question: "So what is the point in worrying about what others do?"
--Speaking for myself -- 1) I have kids too young to be vaccinated and want to best protect them 2) I actually care about the health and safety of others 3) I actually care about the health and safety of YOU and would like to see you safely at a show on down the road 4) with the LARGE data set we have now, the science behind the vaccine is damn near infallible - choosing not to get the vaccine is a very poor decision that has *mostly* personal consequences, but certainly *some* potential public impact.

The fact that I am vaccinated helps the general public. Those that are unvaccinated potentially have a negative impact to the general public. Period. Hard stop.

Is it mandatory? No. It is a personal choice? Sure. Are you putting yourself and others at *some* sort of risk if you choose not to get it? Yes. (again...period. hard stop.)

Ok - I've directly answered a question. Now it is you turn. I think Mundane asked some good questions that, if answered honestly, would help us all better understand your frame of reference, and whatever argument you are making. Otherwise, you just seemed to be bombing the thread with increasingly conflated gibberish.

[boyyourself]

I don't understand why you seem to be treating it as an either/or rather than a both/and. You probably have good points about a more holistic view of wellness. But since you say you aren't anti-vaxx, why not do both? We can have workshops about Zinc and Vitamin D once we can safely gather in large groups again--thanks to vaccines.

I’m not saying we can’t do both.
But the reality is not everyone is gonna get this vaxx. It seems like a futile notion to think that they are or to shake a fist at people and wonder what’s wrong with them. This isn’t dealing with reality. And I can’t technically exposing herd immunity but think we all kind of agree on what the jist of it is and it seems we are headed that way.
Again I don’t get why you wouldn’t feel protected and safe if you have been vaccinated. So what is the point in worrying about what others do?

I'll answer this question: "So what is the point in worrying about what others do?"
--Speaking for myself -- 1) I have kids too young to be vaccinated and want to best protect them 2) I actually care about the health and safety of others 3) I actually care about the health and safety of YOU and would like to see you safely at a show on down the road 4) with the LARGE data set we have now, the science behind the vaccine is damn near infallible - choosing not to get the vaccine is a very poor decision that has *mostly* personal consequences, but certainly *some* potential public impact.

The fact that I am vaccinated helps the general public. Those that are unvaccinated potentially have a negative impact to the general public. Period. Hard stop.

Is it mandatory? No. It is a personal choice? Sure. Are you putting yourself and others at *some* sort of risk if you choose not to get it? Yes. (again...period. hard stop.)

Ok - I've directly answered a question. Now it is you turn. I think Mundane asked some good questions that, if answered honestly, would help us all better understand your frame of reference, and whatever argument you are making. Otherwise, you just seemed to be bombing the thread with increasingly conflated gibberish.

I think I’ve answered mundane questions. At least as much as I’m willing to keep trying to explain what you think I mean.
I do appreciate your post. You certainly don’t have to read mine but you do and call it inflated gibberish. Ok man.
We have a difference of opinion on some of these things and I’m not bashing you for yours.
You’ve insinuated before that I lack compassion and that’s fucking laughable.
And I know you’ve me but you obviously don’t know me or you wouldn’t make those kinds of statements about me so I think it’s lazy to accuse me of that just for giving opinions on issues.

When you’re thoughtful with your questions and responses to me and keep it from neons personal then I appreciate it. And I respect your opinions.
Which is obviously not to say you have to respect mine.
Again I though the point or a forum was to share info and opinions so as to try and work through
Complex issues.

[boyyourself]

We’re not going to explain it to you again. We’ve done so several times and you keep ignoring it and looping back to your same talking points.

We? Who you and fauci? You’re brainwashed on talking points designed for profit disguised as science. That’s my whole point. You think you’re an expert. I don’t. I’m with tinnitus. I’m dumb. Never claimed anything else.
Unfortunately you aren’t the only one that gets their panties in a bunch over someone having the gall to have opinions that fly in the face of your programmed beliefs. That’s the danger of programming. It takes away your ability to think for yourself or even tolerate other opinions which I think almost matched the defenition of liberal.
Hmmm

[Zip City]

We’re not going to explain it to you again. We’ve done so several times and you keep ignoring it and looping back to your same talking points.

We? Who you and fauci? You’re brainwashed on talking points designed for profit disguised as science. That’s my whole point. You think you’re an expert. I don’t. I’m with tinnitus. I’m dumb. Never claimed anything else.
Unfortunately you aren’t the only one that gets their panties in a bunch over someone having the gall to have opinions that fly in the face of your programmed beliefs. That’s the danger of programming. It takes away your ability to think for yourself or even tolerate other opinions which I think almost matched the defenition of liberal.
Hmmm

This entire post is patently absurd and, frankly, insulting. “Programmed lemmings/wake up sheeple!” Might play where you’re from, but not with me.

[pearlbeer]

We’re not going to explain it to you again. We’ve done so several times and you keep ignoring it and looping back to your same talking points.

We? Who you and fauci? You’re brainwashed on talking points designed for profit disguised as science.

Okay - here is a direct question related to your comment.

Do you honestly believe that there is a broad conspiracy led by the Government and/or Big Pharma to profit on Covid?

[Mundane Mayhem]

I think I’ve answered mundane questions. At least as much as I’m willing to keep trying to explain what you think I mean.

Generally speaking, you have, in whole or in part. I appreciate the responses.

Can I repost these two and get your direct responses so I understand where you're coming from? This is the piece I still don't quite understand, since you don't dispute that vaccines are safe and effective and aren't an anti-vaxxer (your words):

1) Do you believe the vaccines are causally linked to the rapid decline of COVID cases, hospitalizations, and deaths that began in the first quarter of 2021? Just a yes or no on this one, really.

3) What, specifically, is your hesitation with these particular vaccines?

[tinnitus photography]

HCQ was used all over the world to minimize Covid symptoms yet the big bad clown touted it so it got cancelled. Because science and saving lives and whatnot.

no, that's not why doctors decided that it wasn't effective. they ran clinical trials, and looked at the data. like scientists do.

Nov 9, 2020:
Hydroxychloroquine does not benefit adults hospitalized with COVID-19
https://www.nih.gov/news-events/news-re ... d-covid-19

[boyyourself]

We’re not going to explain it to you again. We’ve done so several times and you keep ignoring it and looping back to your same talking points.

We? Who you and fauci? You’re brainwashed on talking points designed for profit disguised as science.

Okay - here is a direct question related to your comment.

Do you honestly believe that there is a broad conspiracy led by the Government and/or Big Pharma to profit on Covid?

Not necessarily. But our government and big pharma are businesses for profit. You don’t think it’s fair to criticizes who’s profited and why? And to point out positive consequences, as I’ve done here several times.

I’m pretty sure that to make positive change for a better future we must be willing to criticize the past. Do you not agree with that?
What’s wrong with doing that?

Did you see the cdc recommendations on how you are supposed to not handle chickens because of a salmonella outbreak? Did they mention anything about why there might have been salmonella present or did they just tell you not to handle a chicken?
So the cdc is in the resident farmer now?
Do they not know that millions of people that safely haven’t animals everyday sees shit like this and laugh and exhibit a of why a great number of people don’t trust that crap.
Same with the fda that says Mountain Dew and pharmaceuticals are fine but raw milk is poison.
Sorry but it’s about money not lives. It’s not a big conspiracy.

Btw I salute those who decided to do something and get ducks and chickens. The problem is a lot of people put them together and they require extremely different environment.
You put a chicken in a duck habitat or vice versa? Sounds like salmonella waiting to happen.
Take a human out of nature? Then it’s a pathogenic environment that can really only be fixed with drugs. Just like improperly housing animals. You must respect the chickenness of the chicken. The duckness of the duck. The pigness of the pig. It’s not nature but it’s natural and it’s a nice alternative to being dependent on medication.

[Zip City]

Sam Adams makes a profit by selling beer, but it doesn't keep me from cracking open a Summer Ale on the back porch.

Honda makes a profit by selling cars, but it doesn't keep me from driving their vehicles.

DBT makes a profit on merch and show tickets, but I don't let it stop me from going to the show.

[boyyourself]

I think I’ve answered mundane questions. At least as much as I’m willing to keep trying to explain what you think I mean.

Generally speaking, you have, in whole or in part. I appreciate the responses.

Can I repost these two and get your direct responses so I understand where you're coming from? This is the piece I still don't quite understand, since you don't dispute that vaccines are safe and effective and aren't an anti-vaxxer (your words):

1) Do you believe the vaccines are causally linked to the rapid decline of COVID cases, hospitalizations, and deaths that began in the first quarter of 2021? Just a yes or no on this one, really.

3) What, specifically, is your hesitation with these particular vaccines?

I could see putting together an argument that would lead to a “yes” to the first question.

And it’s not that I’m hesitant about taking the vaccine it’s that I have no desire to take it.
If there’s a difference. By The time it was even looking like an option I had already decided I didn’t need it.
Same with the flu shot and they will likely be linked in that way moving forward. Because the COVID shot is going to turn into a yearly booster shot just like the flu shot which I’ve never gotten.
That’s maybe part of my hesitation because what the question a year from now? Hey are you getting your yearly COVID booster? No. Flu shot? No. Five years? Ten years? After herd immunity is reached? The answer will likely always be no.

I agree with you these conversations would be best served over a beer and rock
Show as intent doesn’t get so lost in person.

[boyyourself]

Sam Adams makes a profit by selling beer, but it doesn't keep me from cracking open a Summer Ale on the back porch.

Honda makes a profit by selling cars, but it doesn't keep me from driving their vehicles.

DBT makes a profit on merch and show tickets, but I don't let it stop me from going to the show.

I don’t really get your point.
Liquor stores make less profit when weed is legalized in a particular precinct.
So do try Mexican cartels.

In and out burger ceo makes way less than McDonald’s and their employees make more per hour and are automatically in a work your way up type system. Which environment would you encourage your teenager to choose?
Would you encourage your kid to go outside? Get sweaty? Socialize with other kids? Be in nature?
Or just stay inside so nothing happens?
Which of these scenarios offers more respect to humans and are actually mindful of long term physical and mental wellness for individuals and society?

[pearlbeer]

We? Who you and fauci? You’re brainwashed on talking points designed for profit disguised as science.

Okay - here is a direct question related to your comment.

Do you honestly believe that there is a broad conspiracy led by the Government and/or Big Pharma to profit on Covid?

Not necessarily. But our government and big pharma are businesses for profit. You don’t think it’s fair to criticizes who’s profited and why? And to point out positive consequences, as I’ve done here several times.

I’m pretty sure that to make positive change for a better future we must be willing to criticize the past. Do you not agree with that?
What’s wrong with doing that?

I agree with most of the above. It is fair to criticize and analyze the past, because as you rightly say, this is going to happen again and we should learn from the past to make the next one better. Hell, we didn't do a whole lot better than 1918 and that is pathetic. Where I take issue with your general arguments is dismissing or conflating the criticizing of the past...we can't learn if we say 600,000 dead isn't so bad...or...yeah BUT there are lots of other problems too...etc. AND....I think you might also be missing the goddamn celebration - we've achieved a medical moonshot!! The science behind the RNA technology is fascinating and truly awesome. The Tour is on, masks are coming off and we can apply what we've learned to do better next time (hopefully). *pearlbeer twirls in his Pollyanna dress*

Also...I've just got to say this...getting vaccinated IS part of a healthy lifestyle, just like eating right and leaning more organic. There really isn't any scientific reason you shouldn't get the Covid AND Flu vaccine - and for your health and safety, I truly hope you eventually do.

Also...sorry about the 'gibberish' comment. I didn't really mean it the way it sounded...

Smooches! See you at the Rock Show.

[Zip City]

I had already decided I didn’t need it.

So you never consulted with your physician? Just basing your personal health on gut feelings and old wive's tales?

[Flea]

Sorry, a few more.

3) What, specifically, is your hesitation with these particular vaccines? The accelerated timeline on which they were developed and trialed? The relatively novel technology used in the mRNA vaccines? How about J&J? The lack of data on long-term effects? If so, at what time horizon does that hesitation fade away?

4) Without asking you to divulge personal medical information, given your age and the country you live in, you were very probably vaccinated as a child against a large number of pathogens. Assuming this is the case, would you make different choices for your infant/toddler self, given the opportunity? If yes, which vaccines would you still receive, and which would you forgo? Why?

I’m not nearly educated on vaccines to answer.
If I was having a kid today I’d look into it.

Is it about saving lives? That’s my question.
And if it was, where’s the driving narrative on how to not be high risk? Nowhere. Because it’s not about saving lives.
Hell all the preventions and remedies to Covid all somehow fly in the face of prevailing narratives.
Vitamin D is crucial yet we aren’t encouraged to go outside.
Zinc is crucial yet where’s the info on how to get it naturally through grass fed beef or bison?
Nowhere. It’s all about plant based propaganda.
HCQ was used all over the world to minimize Covid symptoms yet the big bad clown touted it so it got cancelled. Because science and saving lives and whatnot.
I think it’s a dangerous way to go about things if we are truly concerned about the long term
Wellness of our population. Which politicians and pharma are not. Is that news?
So I just don’t think it’s that crazy of a notion to think that the best thing you can do is take charge of your own health. It’s just an opinion.
It doesn’t mean I’m anti vaxx.

You have absolutely no comprehension of science or medicine. Just as I suspected.

[boyyourself]

Sorry, a few more.

3) What, specifically, is your hesitation with these particular vaccines? The accelerated timeline on which they were developed and trialed? The relatively novel technology used in the mRNA vaccines? How about J&J? The lack of data on long-term effects? If so, at what time horizon does that hesitation fade away?

4) Without asking you to divulge personal medical information, given your age and the country you live in, you were very probably vaccinated as a child against a large number of pathogens. Assuming this is the case, would you make different choices for your infant/toddler self, given the opportunity? If yes, which vaccines would you still receive, and which would you forgo? Why?

I’m not nearly educated on vaccines to answer.
If I was having a kid today I’d look into it.

Is it about saving lives? That’s my question.
And if it was, where’s the driving narrative on how to not be high risk? Nowhere. Because it’s not about saving lives.
Hell all the preventions and remedies to Covid all somehow fly in the face of prevailing narratives.
Vitamin D is crucial yet we aren’t encouraged to go outside.
Zinc is crucial yet where’s the info on how to get it naturally through grass fed beef or bison?
Nowhere. It’s all about plant based propaganda.
HCQ was used all over the world to minimize Covid symptoms yet the big bad clown touted it so it got cancelled. Because science and saving lives and whatnot.
I think it’s a dangerous way to go about things if we are truly concerned about the long term
Wellness of our population. Which politicians and pharma are not. Is that news?
So I just don’t think it’s that crazy of a notion to think that the best thing you can do is take charge of your own health. It’s just an opinion.
It doesn’t mean I’m anti vaxx.

You have absolutely no comprehension of science or medicine. Just as I suspected.

You have nothing to add. No surprise.
Trump sucks. There. Something you can comprehend.

[boyyourself]

I had already decided I didn’t need it.

So you never consulted with your physician? Just basing your personal health on gut feelings and old wive's tales?

Actually yes. And for those inquiring Minds that cant seem to form a thought that runs deeper than gotcha games, I have a doctor that I trust.
He once fixed an Achilles’ tendon of mine that tore completely in two. On some other occasion I had a partially torn minuscus that he recommended no surgery saying if I strengthened everything around it that it would be fine.
See the difference? That’s why I trust that particular care physician. He also helped me get off gout medication through natural
Means. More insane crazy talk right?

[Zip City]

Yes what? Yes you talked to your doctor, or yes you’re going by your gut?

[boyyourself]

Yes what? Yes you talked to your doctor, or yes you’re going by your gut?

I’ve talked to several doctors about it

[LBRod]

[
Do you honestly believe that there is a broad conspiracy led by the Government and/or Big Pharma to profit on Covid?

Nope, just business as usual, with an extra helping of government control, because they can.

[Zip City]

Yes what? Yes you talked to your doctor, or yes you’re going by your gut?

I’ve talked to several doctors about it

And they all told you to skip the vaccine and stick your hands in compost instead?

[boyyourself]

Yes what? Yes you talked to your doctor, or yes you’re going by your gut?

I’ve talked to several doctors about it

And they all told you to skip the vaccine and stick your hands in compost instead?

I don’t have a problem what any of your opinions are. Whatever they are. And happy to be providing with you with such amazing jokes.
You asked all those questions just to get the that?
Is the jerk store store full of you costanza?

[Zip City]

I’ve talked to several doctors about it

And they all told you to skip the vaccine and stick your hands in compost instead?

I don’t have a problem what any of your opinions are. Whatever they are. And happy to be providing with you with such amazing jokes.
You asked all those questions just to get the that?
Is the jerk store store full of you costanza?

I'm working with what you're giving me here. In one breath you're saying you consulted several doctors and in another you say that you're just going with your gut and believe that compost makes your immune system stronger. From the outside looking in, you're not making much sense

[boyyourself]

Can two things be true?

[Zip City]

Can two things be true?

So what did the doctors tell you'?