And, in other news, the Betts trade is falling apart. Reports say the Twins are pulling out of the deal

Zip City wrote:And, in other news, the Betts trade is falling apart. Reports say the Twins are pulling out of the deal

Craziness.

So this whole Betts deal has been one of the strangest things I've ever seen. It probably should spark a conversation about when things should come out in the media and what teams can do to stop these kind of leaks before deals are finished. In the end I suppose Boston did better than it originally looked like they would but if I'm trading the second best player in the game I'm getting an arm back and they didn't. I haven't seen either young man play so my scouting is limited to some YouTube videos and the various scouting reports. Fangraphs scouting isn't high on either guy although they're slightly more bullish on Jeter Downes than they are on Connor Wong. I hope these guys plus Alex Verdugo are better than some expect.

Tequila Cowboy wrote:So this whole Betts deal has been one of the strangest things I've ever seen. It probably should spark a conversation about when things should come out in the media and what teams can do to stop these kind of leaks before deals are finished. In the end I suppose Boston did better than it originally looked like they would but if I'm trading the second best player in the game I'm getting an arm back and they didn't. I haven't seen either young man play so my scouting is limited to some YouTube videos and the various scouting reports. Fangraphs scouting isn't high on either guy although they're slightly more bullish on Jeter Downes than they are on Connor Wong. I hope these guys plus Alex Verdugo are better than some expect.

Feh. It doesn't matter. A pig is a pig no matter how much lipstick one frantically applies to it.

beantownbubba wrote:

Tequila Cowboy wrote:So this whole Betts deal has been one of the strangest things I've ever seen. It probably should spark a conversation about when things should come out in the media and what teams can do to stop these kind of leaks before deals are finished. In the end I suppose Boston did better than it originally looked like they would but if I'm trading the second best player in the game I'm getting an arm back and they didn't. I haven't seen either young man play so my scouting is limited to some YouTube videos and the various scouting reports. Fangraphs scouting isn't high on either guy although they're slightly more bullish on Jeter Downes than they are on Connor Wong. I hope these guys plus Alex Verdugo are better than some expect.

Feh. It doesn't matter. A pig is a pig no matter how much lipstick one frantically applies to it.

Well, I know you don’t see it this way, but he had to be traded if they weren’t going to sign him. I know you think the team could have competed, but that was as unlikely as my Cubs competing this year. It’s just the new economics of the game.

Tequila Cowboy wrote:It’s just the new economics of the game.

I guess the question is whether "just" is an appropriate modifier. The economics of the game have now negatively affected my ability to enjoy the game. It's hard to see who the winners are in that situation (assuming I'm not alone in my reaction).

beantownbubba wrote:The economics of the game have now negatively affected my ability to enjoy the game.

Those are the same economics that have given your team 4 world series titles in the past 15 years and contributed to about 20 other teams' fans having their enjoyment "negatively affected" for years. What goes around comes around.

Clams wrote:

beantownbubba wrote:The economics of the game have now negatively affected my ability to enjoy the game.

Those are the same economics that have given your team 4 world series titles in the past 15 years and contributed to about 20 other teams' fans having their enjoyment "negatively affected" for years. What goes around comes around.

I don't think we're talking about the same thing, though the net effect is similar and no doubt the Sox have benefited by being a wealthy big market team.

beantownbubba wrote: It's hard to see who the winners are in that situation (assuming I'm not alone in my reaction).

As always, the winners are the owners.

LBRod wrote:

beantownbubba wrote: It's hard to see who the winners are in that situation (assuming I'm not alone in my reaction).

As always, the winners are the owners.

I'm trying to do what I can about that. Now if only another 2 million or so fans would join me...

I’ll take today’s MLB economics over the old ones any day. Or have some of you forgotten that the Yankees won the AL pennant 14 of 16 years from 1949 through 1964?

Bill in CT wrote:I’ll take today’s MLB economics over the old ones any day. Or have some of you forgotten that the Yankees won the AL pennant 14 of 16 years from 1949 through 1964?

There was no free agency then. Completely different thing.

Clams wrote:

beantownbubba wrote:The economics of the game have now negatively affected my ability to enjoy the game.

Those are the same economics that have given your team 4 world series titles in the past 15 years and contributed to about 20 other teams' fans having their enjoyment "negatively affected" for years. What goes around comes around.

The economics changed a great deal with the last CBA when draft and IFA penalties were added to the monetary penalties. The Dodgers were over the CBT for 9 years happily paying the penalties but when the other penalties were added brought Andrew Friedman in, got below the CBT to reset, and will now likely reset every 2-3 years. Pretty much all the big market clubs are doing the same thing. Boston is doing it this year, the Yankees did it in 2017 and the Cubs are likely to do it this year if they fall out of contention before the deadline.

The Red Sox speak. I am not impressed.

https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/reds ... newsletter

manfred's handling of the astros case seems to be getting worse by the day, somehow

if it wasnt bad enough to provoke strong words from mike trout, who may not have ever had an opinion in his life, now even lebron james is calling him out

i know commissioners pretty much only exist to shield owners from criticism so im sure his job is safe but what a disastrous PR display. his discipline and his quotes seem to have all done absolutely nothing to quell the outrage from within the sport and beyond. sure bodes well for the coming season

Shakespeare wrote:manfred's handling of the astros case seems to be getting worse by the day, somehow

if it wasnt bad enough to provoke strong words from mike trout, who may not have ever had an opinion in his life, now even lebron james is calling him out

i know commissioners pretty much only exist to shield owners from criticism so im sure his job is safe but what a disastrous PR display. his discipline and his quotes seem to have all done absolutely nothing to quell the outrage from within the sport and beyond. sure bodes well for the coming season

I think he (and his advisors) completely misjudged the level of revulsion the public would have for this. He probably saw a problem big enough that it had to be dealt w/ but not one that actually had repercussions for the entire sport and everyone involved in it. On that basis I'm sure he (and his advisors) thought that his response would look transparent, tough and on top of things. Whoops.

i will say im a little surprised (in a good way) at how much anger there is from players around the league. i'd figured so many would brush it off as "everyone cheats/tries to cheat, the astros just went a bit too far" but that doesnt seem to be the case at all. thats where this has the potential to really get ugly

and also, manfred calling the world series trophy a piece of metal. yikes. ive generally not agreed with the "he hates baseball" takes in response to a lot of his proposals but thats just such a face plant it makes it hard to fathom he actually understands sports at all.

Shakespeare wrote:i will say im a little surprised (in a good way) at how much anger there is from players around the league. i'd figured so many would brush it off as "everyone cheats/tries to cheat, the astros just went a bit too far" but that doesnt seem to be the case at all. thats where this has the potential to really get ugly

Yes, exactly.

Shakespeare wrote:and also, manfred calling the world series trophy a piece of metal. yikes. ive generally not agreed with the "he hates baseball" takes in response to a lot of his proposals but thats just such a face plant it makes it hard to fathom he actually understands sports at all.

I had not heard that particular quote (I'm not following the story closely) but yikes indeed. That is jaw droppingly stupid and even more tone deaf. Hard to understand, really.

Shakespeare wrote:i will say im a little surprised (in a good way) at how much anger there is from players around the league. i'd figured so many would brush it off as "everyone cheats/tries to cheat, the astros just went a bit too far" but that doesnt seem to be the case at all. thats where this has the potential to really get ugly

and also, manfred calling the world series trophy a piece of metal. yikes. ive generally not agreed with the "he hates baseball" takes in response to a lot of his proposals but thats just such a face plant it makes it hard to fathom he actually understands sports at all.

I'm a bit surprised at the players as well but I also think there were other teams doing it so who's going end up with egg on their face?

The continued anger about the Astros scandal has gotten a little out of hand. Astros players getting death threats, Mike Fiers getting death threats presumably from Astros fans, and the complete inability of baseball fans to talk about anything else. Now I'm seeing anger towards the MLBPA blaming them for the players not getting punished. First of all the players weren't punished because they were given immunity to talk, without which a case likely couldn't have been brought against Houston and even more to the point MLB never negotiated rules to govern cheating of this type so the players could not be punished under the CBA. In my opinion MLB has fucked this up every which way. First they never devised mechanisms to deal with this and then when Manfred did hand down punishment he failed to recognize the shitstorm to come. Fans need to calm the fuck down though. Nothing they say or do is going to change anything at this point and to turn this on the MLBPA is just dumb. Also today's news that a decision on the Red Sox won't come until next month isn't helping anything and suggests that Manfred might go even harder on them to try to appease fans hungry for blood. What a fucking mess.

Tequila Cowboy wrote:The continued anger about the Astros scandal has gotten a little out of hand. Astros players getting death threats, Mike Fiers getting death threats presumably from Astros fans, and the complete inability of baseball fans to talk about anything else. Now I'm seeing anger towards the MLBPA blaming them for the players not getting punished. First of all the players weren't punished because they were given immunity to talk, without which a case likely couldn't have been brought against Houston and even more to the point MLB never negotiated rules to govern cheating of this type so the players could not be punished under the CBA. In my opinion MLB has fucked this up every which way. First they never devised mechanisms to deal with this and then when Manfred did hand down punishment he failed to recognize the shitstorm to come. Fans need to calm the fuck down though. Nothing they say or do is going to change anything at this point and to turn this on the MLBPA is just dumb. Also today's news that a decision on the Red Sox won't come until next month isn't helping anything and suggests that Manfred might go even harder on them to try to appease fans hungry for blood. What a fucking mess.

100%. its embarrassing but really should have been mostly predictable by the league bigwigs. all manfred had to do was look to the nfl for a case study in how not to handle these things. handing out immunity was probably a requirement but overall hes done just about everything wrong

the 2017 title is forever tainted, whether its officially vacated or not, and the astros will be booed hard around the country for the foreseeable future. thats all fine and good but death threats are obviously beyond the pale and any team stupid enough to blatantly throw at houston all year deserves their own suspensions.

So Ian Desmond is among a handful of players who have opted out of playing this summer due to concerns over covid and other issues which he elaborates on in a lengthy Instagram post. It's worth reading in full.

I've been getting by on UFC and nascar, but finally I get to root against the Yankees and Dodgers tonight.

LBRod wrote: ↑

Thu Jul 23, 2020 2:39 pm

I've been getting by on UFC and nascar, but finally I get to root against the Yankees and Dodgers tonight.

No soccer? Desperate times call for desperate measures.....

Yo, Rod! Come get your racist WS hero.

Good old Aubrey. The bitterest of clingers. He is not a fan of this year's team.

Aubrey Huff is an awful person

I mentioned soccer earlier strictly for profiling purposes.

@beantownbubba : For the love of God, why in the world did Boston let Mookie Betts go? Watched the Dodgers game last night & it appears that he could very well be the final piece that wins them a world series.

chuckrh wrote: ↑

Fri Jul 24, 2020 6:37 am

@beantownbubba : For the love of God, why in the world did Boston let Mookie Betts go? Watched the Dodgers game last night & it appears that he could very well be the final piece that wins them a world series.

You're asking the wrong person. I washed my hands of the team the moment that happened. Being a Red Sox fan is a full time job and one that I loved for decades. But for John Henry to make a payroll saving move w/ one of the 3 or 4 best players of his generation was too much cynicism and hypocrisy for me. Henry is welcome to run his team as a business and I am entitled to have no more loyalty and pay no more attention to it than I pay to any other business.