The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

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Zip City
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Zip City »

I’m not a fan of Biden either, but I’m not sure what he’s supposed to do to fix these global problems.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

guitarmanmcs wrote:
Sat May 21, 2022 12:04 am
Not an active member like you most. But I’m packing it in. I’m done. I’ve seen enough. Build Back Better. What a crock of shit. Trump 2024. Or anyone that can expose this incompetent piece of shit for what he is. I’ll settle for some mean tweets right now. Had to borrow out of my retirement to survive this piece of fucking shit we call a president to feed my family. But at least illegals are fed and no transgender people were offended. Never thought the day would come. Can’t even afford to see a local DBT show, 20 miles from home. You all keep hiding your heads up your asses. Enjoy your $5 plus a gallon gas. Hope you all come your senses, the writing is on the wall. Love to you all. It’s been a fun ride the last 15 years.
Your anger is understandable, but I don't get how Biden gets the blame and your proposed solution (Trump) well, be careful what you wish for
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

Is this really an acceptable cost for enforcing a misunderstanding of history and the Constitution? I'm very curious as to how that particular risk/reward, cost/benefit analysis gets made. I would say that it's ironic that we're in this situation because a bunch of supposed Constitutional "originalists" twisted both the actual words and original intent of the framers to reach an absurd result, but irony is way too polite a term for "outrageously, murderously, disastrously and completely fucked up."

I sincerely hope that we do not hear a single damn word about how this is all a hoax perpetrated by a bunch of child actors or some such nonsense.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by pearlbeer »

I have no words, other than those shared by Rep. Ruben Gallego.


Rep. Ruben Gallego (D-AZ) lashed out at the gun lobby and the politicians who enable it on Tuesday following the massacre at Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas. In a series of tweets, the Marine Corps combat veteran wrote “fuck you @NRA” before replying to Sen. Ted Cruz’s claim that “Inevitably when there's a murderer of this kind, you see politicians try to politicize it, you see Democrats and a lot of folks in the media whose immediate solution is to try to restrict the constitutional rights of law abiding citizens,” by telling the Texas Republican, “Fuck you @tedcruz you care about a fetus but you will let our children get slaughtered. Just get your ass to Cancun. You are useless.” Gallego added in a second tweet, “Just to be clear fuck you @tedcruz you fucking baby killer.” Finally, he responded to GOP Rep. Darrell Issa’s offer of “thoughts and prayers” with “Fuck your prayers. They haven’t worked for the last 20 mass shootings how about passing laws that will stop these killings.”

https://www.thedailybeast.com/ruben-gal ... s?ref=home
Last edited by pearlbeer on Wed May 25, 2022 1:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

Based on the responses I've been seeing (a small and random sampling of what's out there), I would not be surprised if we soon see the complete morphing of the term "baby killer" from describing pro-choice advocates to describing anti-gun control advocates.
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cortez the killer
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by cortez the killer »

beantownbubba wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 10:17 am
I sincerely hope that we do not hear a single damn word about how this is all a hoax perpetrated by a bunch of child actors or some such nonsense.
That tactic is so 2012-18. We’re onto the next charade….
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

Greg Abbott is a fucking asshole. No surprise, I know.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

Bottom line Abbott and Patrick are hiding behind the dead children and their families. It's disgusting and I don't know how they live with themselves.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by pearlbeer »

beantownbubba wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 1:51 pm
Bottom line Abbott and Patrick are hiding behind the dead children and their families. It's disgusting and I don't know how they live with themselves.
I hate them with every inch of my soul. They are awful excuses for human beings. Horrible, cynical, stupid, terrible assholes.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Flea »

beantownbubba wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 11:10 am
Based on the responses I've been seeing (a small and random sampling of what's out there), I would not be surprised if we soon see the complete morphing of the term "baby killer" from describing pro-choice advocates to describing anti-gun control advocates.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Flea »

pearlbeer wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 2:13 pm
beantownbubba wrote:
Wed May 25, 2022 1:51 pm
Bottom line Abbott and Patrick are hiding behind the dead children and their families. It's disgusting and I don't know how they live with themselves.
I hate them with every inch of my soul. They are awful excuses for human beings. Horrible, cynical, stupid, terrible, extremely wealthy and powerful assholes.
Fixed it for ya!
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by scotto »

And it has nothing to do with mental health. Shut the fuck up about that stuff.

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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

This got some very positive comments when I posted it elsewhere, so I thought some of y'all might find it worth your time. It was in response to a guy who said that there should be equal outrage about gun deaths in Chicago and other cities. Slightly revised for clarity and to eliminate irrelevant specifics.

I never watch/listen to politicians speak or answer questions because it makes me either mad or ill no matter who is speaking, but I happened to see Governor Abbott speak Wednesday. His answer to what about gun control was what about Chicago? And LA and NYC for good measure. There are a number of problems with this response.

The first is that Abbott obviously doesn't care about violence in Chicago and was just deflecting, drawing attention away from his own failures and responsibility, not seriously answering or offering solutions that include both Chicago and TX elementary schools. The second is that, just like on the collective schoolyards of our youth, two wrongs don't make a right. The third is that what aboutism is not a solution and coming from many people, especially politicians and lobbyists, it is not even a good faith effort towards looking for solutions. It is political grandstanding.

But the biggest problem with "what about Chicago?" is that the gun violence in Chicago is different from the gun violence that wipes out school classrooms. Yes, people die in both, children die in both and both are bad problems that cause great pain and need our outrage, attention and best thinking on solutions, but that's the end of the similarities. Gang related handgun violence is different from school shootings. Drive by shootings are different from school shootings. Gun violence committed during the commission of other crimes, from home invasions to armed robbery and beyond is different from school shootings. All those situations are different occur in circumstances not comparable to schools, they are largely committed by people who are very different than the typical school shooter using different kinds of weapons and the causes and motivations for the violence is different. Sometimes the methods of obtaining weapons are different as well.

Conflating schools and "Chicago" allows two bit politicians to hide behind "mental health" as the cause and improved mental health access as the solution which is lazy, hypocritical thinking from the very same politicians who underfund both mental health services and the other services that help individuals better manage their mental health issues. One can argue that anybody who commits murder or who shoots a gun in the commission of a crime has "mental health issues" but it is not a serious position to say that the mental health issues that lead to mass school shootings are the same mental health issues that lead to gang violence or armed robberies. Conflating the two allows politicians to say that banning assault weapons hasn't stopped street crime in Chicago, which is a true but meaningless statement because assault weapons aren't the problem in Chicago. Conflating the two is just another way that people who propose moronic suggestions like "hardening" school buildings try to desperately and laughably twist and turn to avoid even mentioning the words "guns" or "assault weapons." This approach just allows for continued deflection, misdirection, sleight of tongue and failure to address either problem, which is, of course, the goal of many/most of the people who make this argument.

Many people care about gun violence in Chicago and school shootings equally and want to solve both problems. And it is surely correct to say that street violence doesn't generate enough outrage. But the problem is the company your arguments keep. They are often made by people who are not serious about addressing gun violence of any sort, who refuse to acknowledge that the prevalence of guns and the ease of access to them might possibly be part of the problem, people who think it is more important that individuals on the no fly list retain access to weapons than that the public be protected people who have established themselves as the worst sort of hypocrites, liars and intellectually dishonest manipulators and demagogues, people who constitute the supercynical "thoughts and prayers crowd." Therefore those arguments come to this time and place thoroughly discredited, whatever kernels of truth they might contain. Chances are you don't want to be stuck with the Wayne LaPierres, Greg Abbotts, Ted Cruz's and Mitch McConnells of the world any more than I want to be stuck with, say, those calling for the literal defunding of the police. But that's the reality we both have to face and surmount if we want to get anywhere in the direction of reducing these horrible and continuing deaths. So don't be surprised that your cry of "what about Chicago?" is met with cynicism and silence or that proposed solutions like even more mass incarceration (! :shock: ), to say nothing of the outrageous suggestion to "harden" schools, are met with scorn and suspicion.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Flea »

^^^^^
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Zip City
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Zip City »

Chicago has weirdly been crowned the kings of gun violence, when on a per capita basis, they aren’t even top 15
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Mundane Mayhem »

Zip City wrote:
Sat May 28, 2022 7:41 pm
Chicago has weirdly been crowned the kings of gun violence, when on a per capita basis, they aren’t even top 15
I think it’s the calculus as opposed to the static number. Rate of change. Chicago has experienced a terrifying surge of gun violence in recent years, and no one really seems to have a convincing explanation as to why. So it’s a Rohrschach Test of sorts, as everyone rushes to fill the vacuum with the explanation that lines up most neatly with their own ideology.

Add to that the fact that the victims and perpetrators of said violence are often young, Black men, and you see the potential for it to morph from a real problem in need of solving to a racist dog whistle. If Detroit or Baltimore or St. Louis had the size or cultural cache of Chicago I’m sure they’d be used in the same cynical way.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Zip City »

Mundane Mayhem wrote:
Wed Jun 01, 2022 3:00 am
Zip City wrote:
Sat May 28, 2022 7:41 pm
Chicago has weirdly been crowned the kings of gun violence, when on a per capita basis, they aren’t even top 15
I think it’s the calculus as opposed to the static number. Rate of change. Chicago has experienced a terrifying surge of gun violence in recent years, and no one really seems to have a convincing explanation as to why. So it’s a Rohrschach Test of sorts, as everyone rushes to fill the vacuum with the explanation that lines up most neatly with their own ideology.

Add to that the fact that the victims and perpetrators of said violence are often young, Black men, and you see the potential for it to morph from a real problem in need of solving to a racist dog whistle. If Detroit or Baltimore or St. Louis had the size or cultural cache of Chicago I’m sure they’d be used in the same cynical way.
I think it’s also some Daley Derangement Syndrome. The city has had a Democrat mayor for decades and decades, so the city has become an easy place to point to and say “see! The dems can’t even keep their own house in order!”
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by cortez the killer »

Mundane Mayhem wrote:
Wed Jun 01, 2022 3:00 am
Zip City wrote:
Sat May 28, 2022 7:41 pm
Chicago has weirdly been crowned the kings of gun violence, when on a per capita basis, they aren’t even top 15
I think it’s the calculus as opposed to the static number. Rate of change. Chicago has experienced a terrifying surge of gun violence in recent years, and no one really seems to have a convincing explanation as to why. So it’s a Rohrschach Test of sorts, as everyone rushes to fill the vacuum with the explanation that lines up most neatly with their own ideology.

Add to that the fact that the victims and perpetrators of said violence are often young, Black men, and you see the potential for it to morph from a real problem in need of solving to a racist dog whistle. If Detroit or Baltimore or St. Louis had the size or cultural cache of Chicago I’m sure they’d be used in the same cynical way.
People wouldn't do something like that...


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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by cortez the killer »



Image
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

How did Boris Johnson survive that no confidence vote? How does Boris Johnson lead his party and country given the closeness of the vote?
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

So, how widely watched was the Jan 6th hearing around these parts and how widely watched do we think it was nationally?
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by John A Arkansawyer »

beantownbubba wrote:
Thu Jun 09, 2022 10:44 pm
So, how widely watched was the Jan 6th hearing around these parts and how widely watched do we think it was nationally?
I'm not the audience, so I didn't watch. I'm curious what the ratings numbers show.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by dime in the gutter »

watched.

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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by jr29 »

I watched it.
Not gonna move the needle at all.

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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Clams »

jr29 wrote:
Fri Jun 10, 2022 9:35 am
I watched it.
Not gonna move the needle at all.
Agree. Peoples' opinions about Trump were formed long ago. Nothing ever changes anything, on either side. I didnt watch.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

jr29 wrote:
Fri Jun 10, 2022 9:35 am
Not gonna move the needle at all.
Clams wrote:
Fri Jun 10, 2022 9:36 am
Peoples' opinions about Trump were formed long ago.
That's why I asked what I did the way I did. Is there anyone persuadable out there and if they exist did they watch?

The problem, Mr. Clams, is that this is NOT, or should not, be about anyone's opinion about Trump; it's about facts: What happened, who did it, and why. The range of opinions on the MAGA side goes from "mere political discourse" which is factually untrue; to the election was stole which is factually untrue so what Trump et al did was justified, which is a false conclusion based on a false premise; to the other side is just evil so what Trump et al did is justified, which is purely opinion and at least on its face relieves those who hold that belief from considering what actually happened and deciding whether that's really what they want for their country.

If facts, carefully, painstakingly assembled from numerous sources including members of the Trump administration and other Republicans and presented clearly, logically and powerfully, are not relevant and are not useful in convincing anyone of anything the consequences go far beyond anyone's opinion of Trump or of Democrats, liberals or anyone else for that matter, to the actual survival of this country in recognizable form. Those are high stakes. The, ummm, fact that Fox News didn't broadcast the hearing, presumably because it doesn't want its audience exposed to facts, is highly suggestive of the hopelessness of the task but also of its necessity because what the hell else are we gonna do?

We watched mostly to just be counted as watching (on the assumption that cable companies know exactly how many people are watching what, whether or not they know which individuals are watching). But of course we had/have our doubts about whether it means anything. At least the committee did a very good job and Liz Cheney in particular distinguished herself, which I have no problem saying even though there may not be another issue that we agree on.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Clams »

beantownbubba wrote:
Fri Jun 10, 2022 11:16 am

The problem, Mr. Clams, is that this is NOT, or should not, be about anyone's opinion about Trump; it's about facts: What happened, who did it, and why.
Seriously bubba, you think facts still matter? Are you not paying attention?? Have you learned nothing in the last 6 years???
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

Clams wrote:
Fri Jun 10, 2022 11:53 am
beantownbubba wrote:
Fri Jun 10, 2022 11:16 am

The problem, Mr. Clams, is that this is NOT, or should not, be about anyone's opinion about Trump; it's about facts: What happened, who did it, and why.
Seriously bubba, you think facts still matter? Are you not paying attention?? Have you learned nothing in the last 6 years???
IMHO, this is probably the last test of whether facts will ever be part of the conversation again. Of course I know that It is an uphill struggle and that the odds are not good, but I believe it's now or never.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by jr29 »

beantownbubba wrote:
Fri Jun 10, 2022 12:07 pm
Clams wrote:
Fri Jun 10, 2022 11:53 am
beantownbubba wrote:
Fri Jun 10, 2022 11:16 am

The problem, Mr. Clams, is that this is NOT, or should not, be about anyone's opinion about Trump; it's about facts: What happened, who did it, and why.
Seriously bubba, you think facts still matter? Are you not paying attention?? Have you learned nothing in the last 6 years???
IMHO, this is probably the last test of whether facts will ever be part of the conversation again. Of course I know that It is an uphill struggle and that the odds are not good, but I believe it's now or never.
I would like to think there is a small fraction of the population still pliable enough to change the way they think. A small fraction can change the outcome of an election. I'm afraid that ship has sailed though.

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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Mundane Mayhem »

I watched up until the first recess, when my dogs demanded their evening walk.

Thought the part segueing from showing Trump’s Pence tweet on the screen to the video of some terrorist dipshit reading it aloud using a megaphone was pretty powerful.

But yeah, the GOP has long since poisoned the well with regard to this breaking through entrenched notions. Liz Cheney is about to get her teeth kicked in in her own primary and then sail off to a lucrative life of paid news hits, speeches at luncheons with overcooked chicken, and hawking a ghostwritten book called, like, A Matter of Integrity or some such. I agree she comported herself admirably last night, though.
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