The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

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Zip City
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Zip City »

I have no doubt that it's hitting the poorer people the hardest. Those people were already NOT shopping on Black Friday or going to sporting or concert events.
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jr29
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by jr29 »

Zip City wrote:
Sat Dec 03, 2022 4:23 pm
I have no doubt that it's hitting the poorer people the hardest. Those people were already NOT shopping on Black Friday or going to sporting or concert events.
It depends on what you consider poorer, but I take your point.

Zip City
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Zip City »

jr29 wrote:
Sat Dec 03, 2022 4:47 pm
Zip City wrote:
Sat Dec 03, 2022 4:23 pm
I have no doubt that it's hitting the poorer people the hardest. Those people were already NOT shopping on Black Friday or going to sporting or concert events.
It depends on what you consider poorer, but I take your point.

People for whom a 20% hike in groceries means their kids don't eat
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by jr29 »

Zip City wrote:
Sat Dec 03, 2022 5:35 pm
jr29 wrote:
Sat Dec 03, 2022 4:47 pm
Zip City wrote:
Sat Dec 03, 2022 4:23 pm
I have no doubt that it's hitting the poorer people the hardest. Those people were already NOT shopping on Black Friday or going to sporting or concert events.
It depends on what you consider poorer, but I take your point.

People for whom a 20% hike in groceries means their kids don't eat
The poorest among us get shit on the most. We agree.

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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

Other than homelessness, which seems to be an ever growing ever more obvious problem, poverty is often hidden. It's impossible to know which parent chose not to fill the tank in order to feed the kids and therefore got fired when they couldn't get to the job, multiplying the cycle. It's impossible to know which neighbor didn't eat yesterday. Tragically on so many levels, it's impossible to know which neighbor had to forego medical treatment, turning a fixable problem into a death sentence. Inflation surely pushes a good number of people at the margin into poverty and true suffering, but there were plenty of people living in poverty before inflation and it is virtually guaranteed that many of them will still be there after.

When I was a kid the big cliche was the grocery checkout person who knew the elderly person buying that dog food didn't have a pet. That still happens, but the story is much deeper and wider than that and just as unspoken.

I am old enough that i have to have periodic colonoscopies [pause for the usual jokes, even though the jokemeisters are doing the same thing]. I got a notice that it was time to make an appointment, so I called the number. First available appointment? June 2023. That's neither here nor there and I'm in no rush to have the procedure but I'm gonna guess that wait, on my pretty much gold plated private insurance, is not much different than the wait in Canada or England. Once again I ask, what is so great about our insurance/medical system and especially what's so great about it that we'd rather keep it than cover everybody? To be clear, I'm not complaining about my insurance which like i said, is about as good as it gets and has served us well in difficult moments. I just wonder why we routinely assume that our system is so great (and so much better than other systems) rather than actually looking at it and trying to improve it (especially to cover more people). I am not going to even mention those states that have chosen not to provide the medicaid expansion that Obamacare allows and that the feds pay for. Nope, not gonna mention it. Nope, no need to go there yet again. Cough, cough assholes cough.
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chuckrh
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by chuckrh »

beantownbubba wrote:
Tue Dec 06, 2022 11:15 am
Other than homelessness, which seems to be an ever growing ever more obvious problem, poverty is often hidden. It's impossible to know which parent chose not to fill the tank in order to feed the kids and therefore got fired when they couldn't get to the job, multiplying the cycle. It's impossible to know which neighbor didn't eat yesterday. Tragically on so many levels, it's impossible to know which neighbor had to forego medical treatment, turning a fixable problem into a death sentence. Inflation surely pushes a good number of people at the margin into poverty and true suffering, but there were plenty of people living in poverty before inflation and it is virtually guaranteed that many of them will still be there after.

When I was a kid the big cliche was the grocery checkout person who knew the elderly person buying that dog food didn't have a pet. That still happens, but the story is much deeper and wider than that and just as unspoken.

I am old enough that i have to have periodic colonoscopies [pause for the usual jokes, even though the jokemeisters are doing the same thing]. I got a notice that it was time to make an appointment, so I called the number. First available appointment? June 2023. That's neither here nor there and I'm in no rush to have the procedure but I'm gonna guess that wait, on my pretty much gold plated private insurance, is not much different than the wait in Canada or England. Once again I ask, what is so great about our insurance/medical system and especially what's so great about it that we'd rather keep it than cover everybody? To be clear, I'm not complaining about my insurance which like i said, is about as good as it gets and has served us well in difficult moments. I just wonder why we routinely assume that our system is so great (and so much better than other systems) rather than actually looking at it and trying to improve it (especially to cover more people). I am not going to even mention those states that have chosen not to provide the medicaid expansion that Obamacare allows and that the feds pay for. Nope, not gonna mention it. Nope, no need to go there yet again. Cough, cough assholes cough.
Just wait until you get to Medicare.....

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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

chuckrh wrote:
Tue Dec 06, 2022 12:11 pm
Just wait until you get to Medicare.....
The only experience that matters is one's own and i've heard any number of horror stories including yours, but on balance and unscientifically most people seem satisfied w/ medicare especially after the first few months of difficult adjustment. Because of my experiences with my mom, i know a lot of old people and while they're geographically limited, there are a lot of them so net net I'd say Medicare appears more plus than minus, w/ universality of course being a big part of the plus (and again, subject to the often maddening and difficult transition).
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by brettac1 »

I have pretty good insurance and just got a memo today that it's going up 20%+. I assume that's probably pretty standard right now but it's jarring nonetheless.

It's quite pathetic we have been living in a pandemic for ~three years at this point and virtually no change has been made to our healthcare system. Broken beyond repair.
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chuckrh
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by chuckrh »

beantownbubba wrote:
Tue Dec 06, 2022 2:41 pm
chuckrh wrote:
Tue Dec 06, 2022 12:11 pm
Just wait until you get to Medicare.....
The only experience that matters is one's own and i've heard any number of horror stories including yours, but on balance and unscientifically most people seem satisfied w/ medicare especially after the first few months of difficult adjustment. Because of my experiences with my mom, i know a lot of old people and while they're geographically limited, there are a lot of them so net net I'd say Medicare appears more plus than minus, w/ universality of course being a big part of the plus (and again, subject to the often maddening and difficult transition).
Just got back from the drug store. Always a depressing trip. It seems that the system is fine unless you get seriously ill.

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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Zip City »

My only experience with Medicare is vis-a-vis my parents. My dad has Multiple Myeloma, and without Medicare, would have (to this point) paid over $1 million in medications, treatments and hospital stays.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

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Do you ever get tired of singin' songs
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chuckrh
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by chuckrh »

Zip City wrote:
Tue Dec 06, 2022 4:14 pm
My only experience with Medicare is vis-a-vis my parents. My dad has Multiple Myeloma, and without Medicare, would have (to this point) paid over $1 million in medications, treatments and hospital stays.
Ya. In my case there's plenty they don't cover. It's all super complicated & overwhelming. I feel sorry for 80 year olds trying to figure it all out. They do cover plenty though. The problem is farther up the food chain with people who contribute basically nothing sucking money up.

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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

A very, very good question, posed by Thomas Edsall in his 12/7/22 column in the NYT:

"Which gets to the larger question that supersedes all the ins and outs of the maneuvering over the Republican presidential nomination and the future of the party: How, in a matter of less than a decade, could this once-proud country have evolved to the point that there is a serious debate over choosing a presidential candidate who is a lifelong opportunist, a pathological and malignant narcissist, a sociopath, a serial liar, a philanderer, a tax cheat who does not pay his bills and a man who socializes with Holocaust deniers, who has pardoned his criminal allies, who encouraged a violent insurrection, who, behind a wall of bodyguards, is a coward and who, without remorse, continually undermines American democracy?"
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Flea »

beantownbubba wrote:
Thu Dec 08, 2022 10:07 am
A very, very good question, posed by Thomas Edsall in his 12/7/22 column in the NYT:

"Which gets to the larger question that supersedes all the ins and outs of the maneuvering over the Republican presidential nomination and the future of the party: How, in a matter of less than a decade, could this once-proud country have evolved to the point that there is a serious debate over choosing a presidential candidate who is a lifelong opportunist, a pathological and malignant narcissist, a sociopath, a serial liar, a philanderer, a tax cheat who does not pay his bills and a man who socializes with Holocaust deniers, who has pardoned his criminal allies, who encouraged a violent insurrection, who, behind a wall of bodyguards, is a coward and who, without remorse, continually undermines American democracy?"
Simple answer: Obama. The Republican base absolutely lost their shit over a black man beating a war hero and a slutty empty red dress. They have not recovered. I do not think they will.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by pearlbeer »

Flea wrote:
Thu Dec 08, 2022 8:21 pm
beantownbubba wrote:
Thu Dec 08, 2022 10:07 am
A very, very good question, posed by Thomas Edsall in his 12/7/22 column in the NYT:

"Which gets to the larger question that supersedes all the ins and outs of the maneuvering over the Republican presidential nomination and the future of the party: How, in a matter of less than a decade, could this once-proud country have evolved to the point that there is a serious debate over choosing a presidential candidate who is a lifelong opportunist, a pathological and malignant narcissist, a sociopath, a serial liar, a philanderer, a tax cheat who does not pay his bills and a man who socializes with Holocaust deniers, who has pardoned his criminal allies, who encouraged a violent insurrection, who, behind a wall of bodyguards, is a coward and who, without remorse, continually undermines American democracy?"
Simple answer: Obama. The Republican base absolutely lost their shit over a black man beating a war hero and a slutty empty red dress. They have not recovered. I do not think they will.
Then they decided they like their war heroes uncaptured. And bet on the red dress again.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by brettac1 »

Flea wrote:
Thu Dec 08, 2022 8:21 pm
beantownbubba wrote:
Thu Dec 08, 2022 10:07 am
A very, very good question, posed by Thomas Edsall in his 12/7/22 column in the NYT:

"Which gets to the larger question that supersedes all the ins and outs of the maneuvering over the Republican presidential nomination and the future of the party: How, in a matter of less than a decade, could this once-proud country have evolved to the point that there is a serious debate over choosing a presidential candidate who is a lifelong opportunist, a pathological and malignant narcissist, a sociopath, a serial liar, a philanderer, a tax cheat who does not pay his bills and a man who socializes with Holocaust deniers, who has pardoned his criminal allies, who encouraged a violent insurrection, who, behind a wall of bodyguards, is a coward and who, without remorse, continually undermines American democracy?"
Simple answer: Obama. The Republican base absolutely lost their shit over a black man beating a war hero and a slutty empty red dress. They have not recovered. I do not think they will.
Or even simpler, "black people." You can draw a pretty straight line that goes something like Goldwater > Nixon > Reagan > Gingrich > George W > Palin > Trump > whatever comes next.

The very issue of this "pride" mentioned by Edsall seems to me to be a "your mileage may vary" situation. If you're someone who this country has more or less "worked for," like Edsall or other types of elite media, etc. the rot never hit the wood under your feet until the Trump era. It's easy to be "proud" in that situation.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Zip City »

Trump followers don't want democracy. They want their guy installed as king and they want their values and ideas enacted while the enemy's ideas are thrown away.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

brettac1 wrote:
Thu Dec 08, 2022 9:51 pm
The very issue of this "pride" mentioned by Edsall seems to me to be a "your mileage may vary" situation. If you're someone who this country has more or less "worked for," like Edsall or other types of elite media, etc. the rot never hit the wood under your feet until the Trump era. It's easy to be "proud" in that situation.
I think this is very insightful and raises a number of questions that will be taxing my brain for the foreseeable future. Is it true that pride in this country has diminished? Has it diminished differently for different groups? Assuming they don't now, did marginalized people have pride in this country at some previous time (pre Trump, pre-Vietnam/civil rights, other), has that changed, how and why? Does pride in one's country mean the same thing to all/most people or is it a squishier term than is commonly assumed? Are there objective measures, or any measures other than anecdotal, for any of this? This is an onion of many complex layers.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by Zip City »

For many, patriotism is a litmus test for whether you are part of the in group or the out group. It fuels the “Colin Kaepernick hates America” type of nonsense that weaponizes patriotism against people who speak up about inequality.

Nationalism is also a foundation of Fascism, which we’re seeing more and more in the daily.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

The culture wars, political polarization, whatever you want to call it, have reached new depths w/ the performative "furor" over the prisoner exchange w/ Russia that freed Brittney Greiner. At first i literally did not believe what i was hearing, but I've now done a little checking (as much as I can stand w/out puking) and this is really happening:

The usual suspects, including Donald Trump and his idiot spawn, are complaining that the Administration didn't secure the release of Paul Whelan rather than Greiner. Whelan was in a Russian prison for more than 2 years while Trump was president and Trump couldn't get his buddy Putin to release Whelan but Whelan's continued imprisonment is somehow Biden's fault. In the case of the usual pundits this is pretty much the usual hypocrisy, sleight of hand and attempt to rewrite history but in the case of Trump and junior this is chutzpah at the same level as the son convicted of murdering his parents who throws himself on the mercy of the court because after all he's an orphan.

The complaints seem to assume that (a) the US had a choice as to who the Russians would release and (b) that because Greiner is a black lesbian basketball player her release is somehow frivolous. The fact that she's a US citizen seems to matter not. The purported weighing of the moral worth of individuals is pretty fucking sickening before one even gets to the factors being weighed. Anybody believe the outrage would have been anywhere near the same if the freed American were, say, LeBron James or Bryce Harper? The transparent homophobia and racism behind much of the uproar would be laughable if it weren't so disgusting. And I"m just gonna say, 'cause I don't know any more than the professedly outraged know, that the idea that Greiner was released because she's "a liberal" is just fantastical to me; I can't even get my mind around it. Is the idea that Biden is literally scraping for every vote? Or that there's a political belief test for who the government will try to help? LIke I say, I don't know and maybe someone(s) in the process actually was motivated in that way, but I find it incredibly difficult to believe and I'm certain that nobody making those claims knows anymore about the participants' motives than I do. And just for yucks, let me ask, wouldn't securing Whelan's release be a better political move for the Administration?

As always the criticism was immediate and vitriolic. Not one person commenting could have had, and still does not have, the slightest idea of what actually happened, what the negotiations were like or what was possible to achieve at what cost. But why should that stop the instant experts, now that "expertise" means "access to a media megaphone?" Note that I'm not talking about legitimate general strategic questions like whether a willingness to negotiate prisoner exchanges puts more Americans abroad at risk.

Sometimes i start to think that I"d like to crawl around in Tucker Carlson's brain to try to figure out what if anything actually goes on in there, but then I quickly realize, no, I really don't want to do that anymore than I'd want to shoot up and piss and vomit on myself to see what it's like to be a homeless junkie.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

According to the NYT, the lame duck Congress will not act to raise the debt limit (much less change the law that requires this periodic exercise) before the Dems lose control of the House before the end of the year. The reasons?:

"a lack of political urgency and a shrinking window to act before the holidays"

I am not making this up. Not exactly how they drew it up back in civics class back when there were civics classes. It's pretty hard to take politicians or the political process seriously when this is the "decision making process." You really don't ever want to see how the sausage is made.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

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I don't know if you could sum up Democratic congressional leadership better than "a lack of political urgency." You can run the entire spectrum of potential political crises and not much would take priority over recess.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

Trump's "digital trading cards" are a kind of Platonic ideal in that their existence is all one needs to know about them; nothing anyone can say (and it seems like a lot has already been said) can possibly add to, provide insight about or effectively criticize the "cards" beyond what is obvious from the announcement of this great opportunity. Stunning in a uniquely 21st century way. The only question is how many suckers, i mean supporters, will actually buy these things?
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

I have read that a pending deal that would finally address the dreamers as well as at least some of the many pressing immigration issues is now dead. Sad for the dreamers themselves, of course, but more proof that despite all the heated rhetoric, charged barbs and performative stunts very few people are actually serious about "doing something" about immigration. Feh.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by pearlbeer »

beantownbubba wrote:
Fri Dec 16, 2022 11:33 am
Trump's "digital trading cards" are a kind of Platonic ideal in that their existence is all one needs to know about them; nothing anyone can say (and it seems like a lot has already been said) can possibly add to, provide insight about or effectively criticize the "cards" beyond what is obvious from the announcement of this great opportunity. Stunning in a uniquely 21st century way. The only question is how many suckers, i mean supporters, will actually buy these things?
Exactly 45,000 suckers. They "sold out" in 12 hours.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

pearlbeer wrote:
Fri Dec 16, 2022 12:16 pm
Exactly 45,000 suckers. They "sold out" in 12 hours.
SMH. Unbelievable. Barnum was surely right when he said that nobody ever went broke underestimating the American people. The only question now is whether Trump keeps selling interests, further diluting the little to nothing the initial buyers have or announces "by popular demand" he's doing a second edition, further diluting the little to nothing the initial buyers have. But hell, $4.5 million in less than 24 hours at about 99% profit margin for doing absolutely nothing - he's laughing all the way to the bank.
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

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The whole NFT "craze" in general is a pure distillation of the absurdity of late capitalism. Somehow people have been convinced to pay money for something they can just right-click on and hit "save as."
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

As suspected, it turns out that the MAGA folks are literally dying to own the libs. It's hard to grasp how truly nuts this is.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2 ... 00007F7AB9
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

So it turns out that someone has been saying the quiet part out loud on the left. First i hear of it, but I think it's good news. Answers and changed behavior would be great but even asking the questions is a good step in the right (no pun intended) direction.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/12/16/opin ... 029039208a
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Re: The Neverending Thread for Political Shit

Post by beantownbubba »

We have all entered a new world. Whether it's a brave one remains to be seen. In an unprecedented move, the House of Representatives has referred the ex-president of the United States to the Dept of Justice for criminal prosecution. There is no history, no road map, no guide for what happens next but it should be interesting. The pressure on Merrick Garland has certainly been turned up a few notches and the special prosecutor's job just got a bit easier but other than that, it's hard to know how this will go. The fact that 4 Congressmen have been referred to the House Ethics Committee is another interesting twist. At the very least those guys will be on the defensive from the start of their majority reign. And John Eastman finally has the first brick fall on his head. Hopefully the anvil isn't far behind.

I can only imagine what's going on in social media land but I'm not looking.
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