Explain the Clash To Me: Artist of the Week 9/22/2014

[Shakespeare]

alright so in most cases i can understand a band's success even if i dont particularly care for them. best example is springsteen, who i cant stand but i at least get it. its obvious why hes so revered even if his songs and the e st bands performances are both painful to my ears. im not a huge smiths fan but its obvious why so many people are. ditto the minutemen, or countless bands i do really like but got into a few years after they would have really blown me away. you dont have to like a band to understand the appeal.

however, ive never understood the reverence so many people have for the clash. theyre a solid punk band with a handful of great tunes but i so often see them elevated to the highest level of acclaim, with london calling as a greatest album of all time candidate (or at least greatest double album) and joe strummer deified as this genius poet. plus the whole "only band that matters" nonsense. i see it both from people old enough to experience the clash in real time and younger folks so i dont think its a case of having to be there.

so what is it that makes the clash anymore than an average punk band?

[RolanK]

Perhaps because they weren't really a punk band. Or maybe I should say not "only" a punk band...

[Shakespeare]

well thats kinda my point. why have they transcended their genre? because they flirted with reggae a bit?

[beantownbubba]

First of all, they're English. And that's important because in England being highly political is a valued maybe even venerated trait while here it's pretty much the opposite. So a lot of the initial hype of the sort that "requires" hipsters and others on the musical cutting edge to jump on board comes from that. But that just creates buzz and gets you a hearing, it doesn't make it stick.

The short version is listen to the first album (UK version of course) and then listen to London Calling. The first is pretty much a "standard" punk album though of a very high quality w/ political lyrics that go far beyond the standard and bursting w/ energy and attitude that by itself is enough to separate them from the pack. LC is a rock album of the very best kind, absorbing and refining and refracting all kinds of identifiable sources yet sounding fresh and original w/, once again, lyrics far above the standard fare for either punk or rock and just bursting w/ more of that special energy and attitude (plus, this time, ambition) that is hard to explain but is instantly recognizable. But the reason to compare the two is to get a sense of the growth of the band which is extraordinary and not something one sees every day, or decade.

Plus don't forget the mainstream hit single. By itself a mainstream hit single for a band on the cutting edge, known for its edginess and playing a style not calculated to earn mainstream US success, is enough to raise them another level or 3. I'm talking about that indefinable something, that merger of popular, critical, hype and substance that makes the whole greater than the sum of its parts. Sprinkle in charisma, authenticity, a reputation for extraordinary live performances* and veneration by a who's who of the music world cutting across genres and you have a potent recipe. And let's not forget: the songs are really really great.

*Like Patterson, I never saw the Clash which remains one of the 2 or 3 biggest regrets of my concert going "career."

PS: All of the above was meant to agree w/ and expand upon RolanK's post.

[Zip City]

I've never really given them much of a shot. Don't know why. Maybe it's the reverence that's off-putting, or maybe to these ears, "Should I Stay Or Should I Go" doesn't sound very punk rock. Maybe I fall between the generations that really dig them (too young to have experienced them first hand, too old to enjoy their time period in a retro way)

[Clams]

Something tell me that this is gonna be a great thread. Can someone please pin it and add "artist of the week" to the title - assuming Mr. Shakespeare consents, that is.

btw while I've always liked and respected the clash, I have to admit, now that shakespeare's got me thinking about it, I'm not exactly sure what gives them their Mt Rushmore status either. But I do know that this is one of my favorite record covers ever:

[beantownbubba]

Yes, how about that record cover. In my interpretation, it is meant to recall Elvis Presley yet blow up all that Elvis spawned. It succeeds brilliantly and is brilliantly representative of the music.

If we're going to pin this, I suggest we do it w/ a warning label such as: WARNING TO TEQUILA COWBOY AND OTHERS SIMILARLY SITUATED: TAKE YOUR MEDS BEFORE OPENING THIS THREAD.

[jr29]

I have never really gotten it either. While I'm no student of either one, I actually enjoy the stuff Strummer did with the Mescaleros more.

[Gang Green]

I truly believe the Clash are one of the sacred cows of rock n roll, and I had to come to terms with this fact several years ago as they were and still are one of my all time favorite bands. Perhaps, they were a bit overrated. I still love the first album, Give em enough Rope and London Calling. And, Sandinista had a lot of good tracks, but it was a three record album with too much, of I don't know what. They could have made two good albums out of Sandinista, but they were fighting with their record company and were trying to fulfill a three record contract with one triple album. Combat Rock was crap in my book. But, some bands hit you just right in the right time of your life, and the Clash was that band for me in my junior year of high school. The Clash, for me, were not only a gateway to other punk, but for Reggae as well. They played Toot's Pressure Drop on a little album called Black Market Clash, and in Sandinista they used a lot of Mickey Dread. The Clash are not well liked by punk purists as their sound on London Calling moved to a more standard MOR type. But, to this day, still love London Calling, but I'm not gonna argue with you if you don't. Below is a quote from the Punk Rock, Early Days Artist of the Week Thread I wrote a couple years ago.

It was the album “London Calling” by the Clash which solidified my undying love for Punk Rock. Again, this sounds incredibly mundane today, as London Calling is consistently listed as the best album of all time in so many half assed music polls, and is disdained by Punk Rock purists alike. But, I remember going down to Crazy Eddie when “London Calling” was released and seeing the album cover with the sticker on the cellophane which said “New Album from the Clash, the only band that matters”. Well I bought that double album and after listening to “Clampdown”, “Spanish Bombs”, ”Guns of Brixton”, “Death or Glory” countless times, the Clash were the only band that mattered to me for about a month in the spring of 1980. And, when I needed a break, I would pull out my “Rocket to Russia” and listen to “We’re a Happy Family”.

[tinnitus photography]

The Clash really had a startling progression and evolution across every record, even if it wasn't your particular cup of tea.

1st - punk rock
2nd - muscular guitar rock record
3rd - sprawling hybrid
4th - sprawl continues, out of control. hip-hop influences and boom box culture start seeping in
5th - some pop sensibilities break the band into new audiences

let's not talk of CTC.

[Zip City]

The Clash really had a startling progression and evolution across every record, even if it wasn't your particular cup of tea.

1st - punk rock
2nd - muscular guitar rock record
3rd - sprawling hybrid
4th - sprawl continues, out of control. hip-hop influences and boom box culture start seeping in
5th - some pop sensibilities break the band into new audiences

let's not talk of CTC.

but what about Big Audio Dynamite II?

[tinnitus photography]

blame Letts.

[Tequila Cowboy]

London Calling has been solidly lodged in my number two record slot of all time (after Exile) for thirty years. I think that even in their earliest days they had a knack for songwriting that was insightful and direct without being overly wordy. They could also write pop songs with aplomb like Lost in the Supermarket which is in my top five songs of all time. It's been a busy week and I''m getting ready to head out to the Glory Fires show solo (Lurleen is too tired and we promised them last night one of us would be there, plus they do fucking Rock) but maybe tomorrow I can put together a little essay on them and transform this thread to an AotW.

[RolanK]

well thats kinda my point. why have they transcended their genre? because they flirted with reggae a bit?

A lot more going on on that album (LC) than just reggae I would say.

Also from a musicianship point of view they started getting really good around that time, especially between the bass and the drums.

[Gang Green]

Can't wait for TC's AotW thread. Call them sacred cows if you want, Bruce doing Clampdown with a little Tom Morello in the mix. Hershey, PA, last May, I enjoyed the shit out of this

[Hud]

Can't wait for TC's AotW thread. Call them sacred cows if you want, Bruce doing Clampdown with a little Tom Morello in the mix. Hershey, PA, last May, I enjoyed the shit out of this

Hell yes!

[paulc]

It's also worth pointing out just how prolific the Clash were. In 5 short years they released 3 single albums, a double album, a treble album plus half a dozen or so singles and B sides that weren't included on albums.

The "only band that mattered" moniker stemmed from they actually cared about their fans. It was common practice to sneak fans in through the dressing room or get people added to the guest list when they couldn't afford a ticket. They also fought to keep the price of their albums affordable. London Calling was sold as a double disc for the price of a single and Sandinista was also similarly discounted.

[Tyler]

Yea, that's the thing....coming in sort of the "peak" of the "big hair and cocaine" era, they were the opposite.

That said, I can see how someone that doesn't get Springsteen doesn't get the Clash either. They're two sides of the same coin, in many ways.

[Shakespeare]

interesting posts. make it an aotw if you want, just keep my title intact

just to clarify two things:
1. i do actually like the clash. i dont play them very often but theres enough i dig on those early records that im glad i own copies. i just never heard them as particularly special, more like a band i felt i should like than one i actually did. lots of stuff from that era im way more likely to pull off the shelf when the mood hits.

2. im not coming at this from any sort of punk purist standpoint. most of my favorite punk rock is probably stuff the purists hate anyway so that has nothing to do with it. i only mention punk rock cuz the clash definitely was a punk band, but over the years theyve been elevated way beyond that, which is where my confusion comes in. it just seems like they grew bigger than punk rock more so than any other band (except arguably the ramones). as an example, a few years ago i saw gorillaz on the plastic beach tour while paul and mick were in the backing band. the guy i went with was as excited to see half of the clash as anyone else on stage, despite not even being a clash fan. as if the clash reside in this beatle-esque stratosphere where seeing any of the members in person inspires awe regardless of ones opinion of their music. to me they did nothing to warrant it, but i guess im in the minority on this.

(just to avoid confusion and unnecessary rage here, i absolutely adore the ramones. trying to think of punk bands that became so popular outside the punk world, before or after their career, is tough.)

theres also the chance i just cant separate the clash from all the godawful ska bands a bunch of my high school friends were into. obv not the bands fault, but i cant handle very large doses of the clash's reggae stuff because of it. even london calling, which i could happily whittle down to an ep's length of great songs

ill get my coat.

[Gang Green]

It's also worth pointing out just how prolific the Clash were. In 5 short years they released 3 single albums, a double album, a treble album plus half a dozen or so singles and B sides that weren't included on albums.

The "only band that mattered" moniker stemmed from they actually cared about their fans. It was common practice to sneak fans in through the dressing room or get people added to the guest list when they couldn't afford a ticket. They also fought to keep the price of their albums affordable. London Calling was sold as a double disc for the price of a single and Sandinista was also similarly discounted.

Great points all, I don't remember the singles and B sides as I didn't see those much in the NY suburbs where I was buying albums. But, yes, London Calling was a super solid double album for the price of a single album all songs great. They could have done more with Sandinista but I still loved it. But, they could have finished off their career with five strong albums, if they got along with their record company, even with Mick Jones wanting to do his hip hop thing with BAD.

Tyler, I think the big hair, cocaine, electronic stuff was hitting right when Combat Rock came out, and Mick Jones was doing the Big Audio Dynamite thing.

[Gang Green]

8 minutes three ass kicking songs.

[Shakespeare]

two of those songs would definitely make my edited london calling

[Tyler]

Great points all, I don't remember the singles and B sides as I didn't see those much in the NY suburbs where I was buying albums..

That may be part of it.... the Clash IMO where one of the last great single-oriented rock banks (of course, the albums were often trancedant as well....)... but I mean , look at the A-sides they released...

White Riot
Complete Control
Clash City Rockers
(White Man) In Hammersmith Palais
Tommy Gun
English Civil War
I Fought The Law
London Calling
Train In Vain
Bankrobber
The Call Up
Police On My Back
Hitsville UK
The Magnificent Seven
Somebody Got Murdered
This Is Radio Clash
Know Your Rights
Should I Stay Or Should I Go
Rock The Casbah
Straight To Hell

How many bands have a run like that?

[Gang Green]

Great points all, I don't remember the singles and B sides as I didn't see those much in the NY suburbs where I was buying albums..

That may be part of it.... the Clash IMO where one of the last great single-oriented rock banks (of course, the albums were often trancedant as well....)... but I mean , look at the A-sides they released...

White Riot
Complete Control
Clash City Rockers
(White Man) In Hammersmith Palais
Tommy Gun
English Civil War
I Fought The Law
London Calling
Train In Vain
Bankrobber
The Call Up
Police On My Back
Hitsville UK
The Magnificent Seven
Somebody Got Murdered
This Is Radio Clash
Know Your Rights
Should I Stay Or Should I Go
Rock The Casbah
Straight To Hell

How many bands have a run like that?

Great stuff Tyler, I know all the songs but I don't remember the singles being released. I don't think I was all that hip. But, I do remember "This is the Radio Clash", for some reason it was playing on the stations in NYC and I could never find the Single in any of my crappy suburban record stores, and it wasn't on any of their albums up to Sandinista at that point. Actually, I do remembe an extended version of the Call Up. It was right around that point in time, spring of 1981 when they played their famous shows at Bonds in New York. They kept playing night after night to insure everyone that wanted to see them got to see them. For some reason, I didn't go, one of my biggest regrets. I think Rev Matt talked about going to at least one of these shows.

[teleburst]

I have a hard time doing this. It's like explaining that it's dark at night.

[Tequila Cowboy]

I have a hard time doing this. It's like explaining that it's dark at night.

Yes.

Haven't forgotten that I was going to write something. Hopefully by this evening.

[RolanK]

I have a hard time doing this. It's like explaining that it's dark at night.

Yes.

Haven't forgotten that I was going to write something. Hopefully by this evening.

I had the same initial reaction, but in here it seems to be a pretty good way to start a thread. And reading OP's clarification on his relationship with the band in question I don't take him literally that he actually expects that it's possible to be convinced by arguments why they should be worth listing to. (In my own short sweet experience, the only possible route to "get" a band is by listening to their music).

[teleburst]

I think it helps to have been there at the sea change.

Even though the Ramones were there first, they weren't very well known in the beginning. The Clash, along with the Sex Pistols, really changed the game at the beginning. Their sound was like a hurricane and nobody had ever heard anything like it. While the Sex Pistols imploded almost instantly, and there were plenty of bands who rode the wave, bands like The Buzzcocks, Stiff Little Fingers, The Jam, and The Damned in the UK, and The Dead Boys, The Ramones, The Stooges, The New York Dolls et.al in the US, The Clash remained the standard bearers. And it's hard to underestimate their importance in the UK.

They just kept building musically, experimenting and expanding without losing the core of the band (until of course, they did late in their Bernard Rhodes' "Clash is a brand" period).

This was their very first song on their very first album. A lot of what became tropes in the Punk/New Wave world was already there (the stabbing, crisp guitar, the spitting vocals, the feedback at the end, etc.) And they only got better as time went on.

[teleburst]

On the next album, this was the lead track. Despite Sandy Perlman's attempt to turn them into Blue Oyster Cult, the energy was still there. Frankly, they still sound fresher to this day than The Ramones do on their early albums (somehow, they seem just a little sluggish than their later efforts and their live tempos - and I LOVE those first three Ramones albums and the songs on them).

They kicked butt. And started to throw in reggae/ska to boot. Thanks Don Letts! If you don't know who he is, Google him.

[Tyler]

Great stuff Tyler, I know all the songs but I don't remember the singles being released. I don't think I was all that hip. But, I do remember "This is the Radio Clash", for some reason it was playing on the stations in NYC and I could never find the Single in any of my crappy suburban record stores,s.

Not that surprising. Despite the singles being so good, they didn't really sell that well, especially in the US - only two of 'em cracked the US Top 40. There were some reissues in the early 90s that actually sold much better.