the Springsteen thread

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Re: the Springsteen thread

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LFG.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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Not sure if this is the entire Stern/Springsteen interview but it'll give you a good taste. I think Stern was a bit too fawning and he obviously was told to avoid the ticket pricing scandal, but overall I think it was a pretty entertaining interview.

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... 2uQdU4tAxe
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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I thought the performances I saw were fun.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

Post by beantownbubba »

The guy is good. Damn good. Hyden, I mean. Agree or disagree w/ the order the guy knows what he's talking about, has great taste and can write about it.

https://uproxx.com/indie/every-bruce-sp ... um-ranked/

Anyone listened to the new album yet?
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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beantownbubba wrote:
Mon Nov 14, 2022 9:31 am
Anyone listened to the new album yet?
One listen in. Pretty much what one would expect, which is not a diss in any way. Clearly a labor of love, very tasteful, very professional and Bruce's vocals are mostly excellent and well matched to the songs. A few of the songs do just cry out for Clarence. Sigh. But as always with projects of this sort I wonder about the equity of it all. The album's been out for 4 days and already 2 songs have well over a million listens and the rest are all in 6 figures and that's just on spotify. I assume the songwriters will see some benefit but still, nothing for the original artists, etc etc. Life just ain't fair. I'm thinking maybe I should buy an album or 2 from the covered artists instead of this one but I have pretty much all of it already, some multiple times, so it's kind of confusing.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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i don't think i've heard a Springsteen record after Born In The USA

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Re: the Springsteen thread

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tinnitus photography wrote:
Mon Nov 14, 2022 2:38 pm
i don't think i've heard a Springsteen record after Born In The USA
Tunnel of Love is essential. I think Magic is, too, but can understand how others might scoff at that opinion. I like several other post-BitUSA albums, but those two stand out the most for me.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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cortez the killer wrote:
Mon Nov 14, 2022 3:03 pm
tinnitus photography wrote:
Mon Nov 14, 2022 2:38 pm
i don't think i've heard a Springsteen record after Born In The USA
Tunnel of Love is essential. I think Magic is, too, but can understand how others might scoff at that opinion. I like several other post-BitUSA albums, but those two stand out the most for me.
For me it's Tunnel and The Rising.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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brettac1 wrote:
Mon Nov 14, 2022 3:23 pm
cortez the killer wrote:
Mon Nov 14, 2022 3:03 pm
tinnitus photography wrote:
Mon Nov 14, 2022 2:38 pm
i don't think i've heard a Springsteen record after Born In The USA
Tunnel of Love is essential. I think Magic is, too, but can understand how others might scoff at that opinion. I like several other post-BitUSA albums, but those two stand out the most for me.
For me it's Tunnel and The Rising.
The Rising is a very strong record.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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I think Magic holds up better than The Rising. I also think Letter to You is better than both of those.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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Clams wrote:
Mon Nov 14, 2022 4:49 pm
I think Magic holds up better than The Rising. I also think Letter to You is better than both of those.
Agree. Have you heard the new one yet? Really enjoyed it. It's a fun record. Some cool choices of songs to cover.

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Re: the Springsteen thread

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Clams wrote:
Mon Nov 14, 2022 4:49 pm
I think Magic holds up better than The Rising. I also think Letter to You is better than both of those.
I think Letter to You and Western Stars are both awesome.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

Post by beantownbubba »

I have always called The Rising Springsteen's best 21st century album but I always liked Magic a lot, too. Hyden pretty much trashes The Rising, which is one place we part ways, but I'm glad he reminded me about Magic which I hadn't listened to for some time but still really like. I don't know which I like better now but I don't know that I have to decide, either :) I liked Letter to You upon release but I've barely thought about it since so staying power may be an issue, I'll have to see/hear how it goes.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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I really disliked the production on Magic, Working on a Dream, High Hopes, and Wrecking Ball a lot when they were released and I've never gone back to listen to them all that often because of it. I'll have to put them on my to-do list. Maybe my views have changed. I hated Tunnel of Love for years until it suddenly clicked for me.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

Post by Clams »

chuckrh wrote:
Mon Nov 14, 2022 4:51 pm
Have you heard the new one yet? Really enjoyed it. It's a fun record. Some cool choices of songs to cover.
I heard a few tracks when they came out last month but haven't listened to the record. I'm generally not a fan of his vanity projects like Western Stars or the soul covers. Just give me some E Street.



Also, on the subject of Magic, our very own Kevbot published a piece in Pop Matters on that record just last month...
https://www.popmatters.com/bruce-spring ... agic-atr15
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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Clams wrote:
Tue Nov 15, 2022 2:31 pm
I'm generally not a fan of his vanity projects like Western Stars or the soul covers. Just give me some E Street.
The album is solid, but that title track.... Damn, do I love it! On some days it might be my favorite Springsteen song.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

Post by chuckrh »

cortez the killer wrote:
Tue Nov 15, 2022 2:35 pm
Clams wrote:
Tue Nov 15, 2022 2:31 pm
I'm generally not a fan of his vanity projects like Western Stars or the soul covers. Just give me some E Street.
The album is solid, but that title track.... Damn, do I love it! On some days it might be my favorite Springsteen song.
I loved Western Stars, especially the video. I'd go see that in a reasonably sized venue. I've got a pretty good tickets for realistic cash for a show in February. Probably my last dance with the boss.

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Re: the Springsteen thread

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https://www.rollingstone.com/music/musi ... 234632658/
Q: It caused a bit of an uproar in the fan community because some of the tickets used dynamic prices, and some tickets hit $5,000. Did you know in advance about those price points and dynamic pricing, and do you have any regrets about that?

A: What I do is a very simple thing. I tell my guys, “Go out and see what everybody else is doing. Let’s charge a little less.” That’s generally the directions. They go out and set it up. For the past 49 years or however long we’ve been playing, we’ve pretty much been out there under market value. I’ve enjoyed that. It’s been great for the fans.

This time I told them, “Hey, we’re 73 years old. The guys are there. I want to do what everybody else is doing, my peers.” So that’s what happened. That’s what they did [laughs].

But ticket buying has gotten very confusing, not just for the fans, but for the artists also. And the bottom line is that most of our tickets are totally affordable. They’re in that affordable range. We have those tickets that are going to go for that [higher] price somewhere anyway. The ticket broker or someone is going to be taking that money. I’m going, “Hey, why shouldn’t that money go to the guys that are going to be up there sweating three hours a night for it?”

It created an opportunity for that to occur. And so at that point, we went for it. I know it was unpopular with some fans. But if there’s any complaints on the way out, you can have your money back.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

Post by beantownbubba »

Did y'all notice that Taylor Swift broke Ticketmaster? There is no end to their unique combination of greed and incompetence.

As for Bruce, I think we're all more or less agreed that it's better for the money to go to the musicians than to the brokers and scalpers but there can be no doubt that some boomers (and maybe some genX'ers too, what do i know?) have way too much money.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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In better news, the Dept of Justice is investigating LiveNation. Better late than never. Let's hope some meaningful benefit to the concert going ticket buying public results.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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Clams wrote:
Fri Nov 18, 2022 4:30 pm
https://www.rollingstone.com/music/musi ... 234632658/
Q: It caused a bit of an uproar in the fan community because some of the tickets used dynamic prices, and some tickets hit $5,000. Did you know in advance about those price points and dynamic pricing, and do you have any regrets about that?

A: What I do is a very simple thing. I tell my guys, “Go out and see what everybody else is doing. Let’s charge a little less.” That’s generally the directions. They go out and set it up. For the past 49 years or however long we’ve been playing, we’ve pretty much been out there under market value. I’ve enjoyed that. It’s been great for the fans.

This time I told them, “Hey, we’re 73 years old. The guys are there. I want to do what everybody else is doing, my peers.” So that’s what happened. That’s what they did [laughs].

But ticket buying has gotten very confusing, not just for the fans, but for the artists also. And the bottom line is that most of our tickets are totally affordable. They’re in that affordable range. We have those tickets that are going to go for that [higher] price somewhere anyway. The ticket broker or someone is going to be taking that money. I’m going, “Hey, why shouldn’t that money go to the guys that are going to be up there sweating three hours a night for it?”

It created an opportunity for that to occur. And so at that point, we went for it. I know it was unpopular with some fans. But if there’s any complaints on the way out, you can have your money back.
In other words, "I did what I did, I meant to do it, no apologies, suck it, see you at the show"
To me it's not even as much about the cost as what an absolutely miserable shitshow the ticket buying "experience" is. Between the stupid presale codes, dynamic pricing, and resellers, it just sucks. I don't expect to see Bruce or someone of that ilk for $20, but I would like to have a fair opportunity to purchase face value tickets.

However, his comments do show how out of touch he is with his fanbase, though not unexpected.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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beantownbubba wrote:
Fri Nov 18, 2022 5:50 pm
Did y'all notice that Taylor Swift broke Ticketmaster? There is no end to their unique combination of greed and incompetence.
which ticket seller do you think could have handled that traffic? wasn't something like 2 million tickets sold in one day? and that's SOLD, not trying to buy.

most engineers wouldn't design something to withstand a 1000 year storm or flood.

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Re: the Springsteen thread

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brettac1 wrote:
Mon Nov 21, 2022 12:10 pm
To me it's not even as much about the cost as what an absolutely miserable shitshow the ticket buying "experience" is. Between the stupid presale codes, dynamic pricing, and resellers, it just sucks. I don't expect to see Bruce or someone of that ilk for $20, but I would like to have a fair opportunity to purchase face value tickets.
that's the rub... until sales actually go live, no one actually knows what the true face value of a given ticket should be. while i am not defending super high ticket prices, if that's what the market will bear why shouldn't the people responsible for the product get most of it, rather than some reseller who can program bots?

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Re: the Springsteen thread

Post by beantownbubba »

tinnitus photography wrote:
Mon Nov 21, 2022 3:26 pm
beantownbubba wrote:
Fri Nov 18, 2022 5:50 pm
Did y'all notice that Taylor Swift broke Ticketmaster? There is no end to their unique combination of greed and incompetence.
which ticket seller do you think could have handled that traffic? wasn't something like 2 million tickets sold in one day? and that's SOLD, not trying to buy.

most engineers wouldn't design something to withstand a 1000 year storm or flood.
It is hard to convey how vehemently I disagree with this. Ticketmaster is a lazy monopolist. We won't know how competitors might handle things until competition is feasible. Besides, one reason that Ticketmaster gets away with its bullshit is that their marketing is basically "trust us, we're the experts" so if you're the experts then be expert or shut the fuck up.

And I beg to differ about how infrequent last week's events were. First of all, those 2 million in sales were completely fucked up - ask the many, many thousands of people who not only got shut out but got their chains yanked by TM just for playing. Second, if Taylor Swift did this today, someone else will do it again w/in a couple of years. It's not an unforeseen event. A few years ago, Bruce used to break TM. And before that it was someone else. If you can't be on the cutting edge of your market you certainly don't deserve to be given special privileges as a monopoly.

Again, the problem is not that artists are getting to keep more of the value they create. The problems are that TM is corrupt and not very good at what it does. Do you seriously believe that their various markets reflect real transactions between real arms length people? If so, I've got this bridge I know you're going to love. Black Friday special price available today just for you.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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can show me another ticket broker that has the infrastructure scale of TM?

I bet for every live human clicking a mouse, there were a million bots doing their thing.


maybe i just haven't tried to use TM for shows w/ huge demand so my experiences aren't mirroring others. the only time i was pissed at TM was when i landed two pit tickets for Nick Cave and then they disappeared from my cart when i went to check out.

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Re: the Springsteen thread

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tinnitus photography wrote:
Mon Nov 21, 2022 8:16 pm
can show me another ticket broker that has the infrastructure scale of TM?

I bet for every live human clicking a mouse, there were a million bots doing their thing.


maybe i just haven't tried to use TM for shows w/ huge demand so my experiences aren't mirroring others. the only time i was pissed at TM was when i landed two pit tickets for Nick Cave and then they disappeared from my cart when i went to check out.
Hate it when that happens! I'm not buying many tickets these days but I usually do ok. I pay attention to presales & such. I have 1 "advantage" in that I'm going for ADA seats. I would gladly give that up but its the only way I can go to shows. Also, these days I don't go for the gucci seats. I start getting real uncomfortable @$100. Even that I gotta think & budget real hard. For instance Buddy Guy is coming on his farewell tour. He's doing a theater shows & decent seats were $100. I think they went to $150. I was hesitating but my friend stepped up & got us tickets. Nice of her.

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Re: the Springsteen thread

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beantownbubba wrote:
Mon Nov 21, 2022 6:30 pm
Do you seriously believe that their various markets reflect real transactions between real arms length people?
sorry to come back to this but i'm not sure what you mean here, btb. that the price is somehow manipulated by TM and it's not a true market price?

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Re: the Springsteen thread

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tinnitus photography wrote:
Tue Nov 22, 2022 10:44 am
beantownbubba wrote:
Mon Nov 21, 2022 6:30 pm
Do you seriously believe that their various markets reflect real transactions between real arms length people?
sorry to come back to this but i'm not sure what you mean here, btb. that the price is somehow manipulated by TM and it's not a true market price?
YES. That's exactly what I mean. And it's been proven. TM is known to have NOT to put some tickets on sale and then put them DIRECTLY on to their resale site as if they have been legitimately purchased and are being resold by arm's length customers. And that's just one scam that we know about.
tinnitus photography wrote:
Mon Nov 21, 2022 8:16 pm
can show me another ticket broker that has the infrastructure scale of TM?
Ummmm, tin, this is exactly my point. There is no competition so who knows how good or bad a job TM is doing? Why should we assume they're doing anything but maximizing profits in classic monopolist form, which almost always means underinvesting in R&D, technology and infrastructure and boosting prices? Neither of us know if TM invested Five Dollars or Five Billion Dollars in research and new technology but where would you put the over/under for a rapacious anti consumer monopolist? Or, put another way, I think we can safely assume that TM's current set up represents the FLOOR of what might be possible w/ real competition, not the ceiling.

Also note TM's opacity (the opposite of transparency) which means nobody really knows what goes on behind that screen except when TM screws up so badly that people start comparing notes and realize that, e.g., it's impossible to buy and post for resale a ticket in a couple of seconds, but there's TM's "resale market" already offering tickets before most people have even gotten through to the site.
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Re: the Springsteen thread

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Re: the Springsteen thread

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^^^^^READ THIS^^^^^

Note especially the impact on smaller artists in smaller venues. Remember Cooley saying DB T isn't in the music business, it's in the tshirt business? How many times has pretty much everyone on this site bought band merchandise (DBT and other) specifically to support the artist? Did you know that TWENTY PERCENT of what you paid went to Ticketmaster????? I didn't.

In this context, Bruce's comments quoted above don't come across real well. Again, I'm not against artists keeping more of the value they create. The problem is Ticketmaster.
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