The Unraveling

Talk about the songs, the shows, and anything else DBT related here.

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Jonicont
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Jonicont »

Tequila Cowboy wrote:
Iowan wrote:Patterson alluded in one of the interviews that "Heroin Again" was about someone he knew that had worked for the band, so like "Do It Yourself" I think it's absolutely personal and deals with some anger that came from that loss. It's highly probable that Patterson had even personally advised this person not to go down that road and they did anyways. There is always an element of choice in drug abuse.

Anger would be a real honest reaction to that for most people, no matter how great your awareness of mental illness.
I can’t remember the young man’s name but it came as a shock to everyone. He interned with and went out as a member of the road crew. He also performed with one of the Camp Amp bands at Homecoming. The Band’s run of playing “Tonight’s the Night” was in his honor as it was his favorite song.
The band had seen this young man grow up. 23yo. Straight A student. About to graduate. Nobody had a clue. Posted this back in 2015. Tonight's the Night. Please don't repost on FB

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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Flea »

Clams wrote: My understanding is that the rise in heroin usage over the last 5 or 10 years is largely due to societal issues such as opioid addiction, homelessness, mental illness and the like. In that context "I thought you knew better than that" can sound kinda harsh. Or maybe I'm reading the song wrong.
If you are going to talk about heroin issues, it comes down to this: Big Pharma was pushing doctors to prescribe the shit willy-nilly, people had ample left over to play with or give away when the pain ended, and then...well, it eventually becomes easier to wait for the man to get the fix that will keep you from being achy and nauseous all day and just be human.

When I left the Mission Hopsital in Asheville with a half-inch steel pipe in my lower leg, I carried with me a prescription bottle of 80 oxycodone tablets. 2 1/2 years ago. I still have 75 left. The sloppiness of the healthcare professions has to be addressed.
Now it's dark.

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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Mundane Mayhem »

Think I should probably clarify that I’m not accusing Patterson of being judgmental or lacking empathy or anything of the sort. Just a stray thought about how a particular line has landed with me in the early stages of my relationship with a song I really like.

My larger point was just how much richer that song is in the context of the album, as BtB said, probably more eloquently than I did.
All it takes is one wicked heart, a pile of money, and a chain of folks just doing their jobs

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Re: The Unraveling

Post by KcGhostToMost »

More thoughts as they come. I agree with all who have said they wished Cooley’s vocals weren’t drowned out by the guitars etc on “Slow Ride Argument”. Makes it hard for me to fully embrace that song. I on the contrary to some on here really like “21st Century USA”. Excellent imagery in that one. I love Cooley’s “Grievance Merchants”. I feel it builds to an epic explosion sonically and lyrically and is his best overall song he’s ever written.

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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Rocky »

Jonicont wrote: The band had seen this young man grow up. 23yo. Straight A student. About to graduate. Nobody had a clue. Posted this back in 2015. Tonight's the Night. Please don't repost on FB
Thanks for the context Doc. Really brings that shit home when things like this happen to someone you know.
By the time you drop them I'll be gone
And you'll be right where they fall the rest of your life

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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Smitty »

There's love, grief and understanding in the bridge and last verse of "Heroin Again" and I think they clear up any issues with moralizing. I say that as a former silly young man who knew better but has had my life saved by naloxone more than once. Personally I'm proud that Patterson wrote the song; it's an antidote to a lifetimes worth of rock and roll songs mythologizing/romanticizing that wonderful, blissful but ultimately despicable, terrible and deadly drug. Even songs like "The Needle and the Damage Done" have a kind of romantic martyrdom aspect to them that "Heroin Again" abolishes and manages to do so by spiking any lecturing or condescension with just the right amount of love & empathy. That's a thin fucking line to walk and I don't think Patterson could've pulled it off without bleeding on the page a little bit; it doesn't come off as some topical writing exercise that was inspired reading a USA Today cover story or something and that's what saves it for me.

I've expressed similar thoughts about "Do It Yourself", that it lacks the understanding of Patterson's later songs that deal with suicide ("Sitting in the Sunshine", "Baggage", "Billy Ringo in the Dark") but it works because it's so honest. Those later songs do cut the subject of DIY some slack, but those feelings are completely valid in the immediate aftermath of losing someone to suicide. There wouldn't be that anger if there wasn't so much love and pain underscoring the loss. The same can be said for "Pin Hits the Shell"; it had to be fucking tough for Cooley to lay himself out so bare but ultimately that's what gives the songs their power; it's because they're true (even when they're not).
Last edited by Smitty on Tue Feb 04, 2020 1:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Iowan »

Yeah, what Smitty said.

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Re: The Unraveling

Post by beantownbubba »

Smitty! Did you know that smitty autocorrects to snotty? But I digress. Smitty, this is terrific writing and spot on. The first paragraph is stunning. I want more!
What used to be is gone and what ought to be ought not to be so hard

Mundane Mayhem
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Mundane Mayhem »

Smitty wrote:There's love, grief and understanding in the bridge and last verse of "Heroin Again" and I think they clear up any issues with moralizing. I say that as a former silly young man who knew better but has had my life saved by naloxone more than once. Personally I'm proud that Patterson wrote the song; it's an antidote to a lifetimes worth of rock and roll songs mythologizing/romanticizing that wonderful, blissful but ultimately despicable, terrible and deadly drug. Even songs like "The Needle and the Damage Done" have a kind of romantic martyrdom aspect to them that "Heroin Again" abolishes and manages to do so by spiking any lecturing or condescension with just the right amount of love & empathy. That's a thin fucking line to walk and I don't think Patterson could've pulled it off without bleeding on the page a little bit; it doesn't come off as some topical writing exercise that was inspired reading a USA Today cover story or something and that's what saves it for me.

I've expressed similar thoughts about "Do It Yourself", that it lacks the understanding of Patterson's later songs that deal with suicide ("Sitting in the Sunshine", "Baggage", "Billy Ringo in the Dark") but it works because it's so honest. Those later songs do cut the subject of DIY some slack, but those feelings are completely valid in the immediate aftermath of losing someone to suicide. There wouldn't be that anger if there wasn't so much love and pain underscoring the loss. The same can be said for "Pin Hits the Shell"; it had to be fucking tough for Cooley to lay himself out so bare but ultimately that's what gives the songs their power; it's because they're true (even when they're not).
Great perspective. I think we're on the same page.
All it takes is one wicked heart, a pile of money, and a chain of folks just doing their jobs

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BigTom
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by BigTom »

When I first heard Heroin Again I immediately thought of You and Your Crystal Meth.
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Iowan
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Iowan »

BigTom wrote:When I first heard Heroin Again I immediately thought of You and Your Crystal Meth.
I thought that when I saw the song title, but after I heard it I felt the songs were world's apart.

I strongly prefer Heroin Again to You and Your Crystal Meth.

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Re: The Unraveling

Post by glennrwordman »

Smitty wrote:There's love, grief and understanding in the bridge and last verse of "Heroin Again" and I think they clear up any issues with moralizing. I say that as a former silly young man who knew better but has had my life saved by naloxone more than once. Personally I'm proud that Patterson wrote the song; it's an antidote to a lifetimes worth of rock and roll songs mythologizing/romanticizing that wonderful, blissful but ultimately despicable, terrible and deadly drug. Even songs like "The Needle and the Damage Done" have a kind of romantic martyrdom aspect to them that "Heroin Again" abolishes and manages to do so by spiking any lecturing or condescension with just the right amount of love & empathy. That's a thin fucking line to walk and I don't think Patterson could've pulled it off without bleeding on the page a little bit; it doesn't come off as some topical writing exercise that was inspired reading a USA Today cover story or something and that's what saves it for me.

I've expressed similar thoughts about "Do It Yourself", that it lacks the understanding of Patterson's later songs that deal with suicide ("Sitting in the Sunshine", "Baggage", "Billy Ringo in the Dark") but it works because it's so honest. Those later songs do cut the subject of DIY some slack, but those feelings are completely valid in the immediate aftermath of losing someone to suicide. There wouldn't be that anger if there wasn't so much love and pain underscoring the loss. The same can be said for "Pin Hits the Shell"; it had to be fucking tough for Cooley to lay himself out so bare but ultimately that's what gives the songs their power; it's because they're true (even when they're not).
I love this. Thank you.

(And your signature: once more we saw stars? Speaking of pain, there's a memoir of the same title by Jayson Greene. It's one of the most extraordinary books I've ever read, but fair warning: it deals with the death of a very young child, and it can be extremely difficult, but so, so worth it. https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/book ... on-greene/)
I’d have a lot of nerve to go feigning shock and outrage/If I'd been my example I’d be worse

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Re: The Unraveling

Post by glennrwordman »

Flea wrote:
Clams wrote: My understanding is that the rise in heroin usage over the last 5 or 10 years is largely due to societal issues such as opioid addiction, homelessness, mental illness and the like. In that context "I thought you knew better than that" can sound kinda harsh. Or maybe I'm reading the song wrong.
If you are going to talk about heroin issues, it comes down to this: Big Pharma was pushing doctors to prescribe the shit willy-nilly, people had ample left over to play with or give away when the pain ended, and then...well, it eventually becomes easier to wait for the man to get the fix that will keep you from being achy and nauseous all day and just be human.

When I left the Mission Hopsital in Asheville with a half-inch steel pipe in my lower leg, I carried with me a prescription bottle of 80 oxycodone tablets. 2 1/2 years ago. I still have 75 left. The sloppiness of the healthcare professions has to be addressed.
This, over and over again. It's all described in this book by Sam Quinones, which will make a feeling person enraged. https://www.bloomsbury.com/us/dreamland-9781620402511/
I’d have a lot of nerve to go feigning shock and outrage/If I'd been my example I’d be worse

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Re: The Unraveling

Post by John A Arkansawyer »

I just got this posted to me today from USPS:
Your item was returned to the sender on February 3, 2020 at 12:55 pm in LITTLE ROCK, AR because the address was vacant or the business was no longer operating at the location and no further information was available.
Apparently they didn't knock, or they'd've woken my roommate.
The sooner we put those assholes in the grave&piss on the dirt above it, the better off we'll be

Narducci19
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Narducci19 »

Is it just me, or are Cooley’s vocals on his two songs kind of muddled? Almost seem clearer in the live recordings I’ve heard of both songs. Love both songs, just interested in why the mixing sounds like it does.

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Re: The Unraveling

Post by brett27295 »

Narducci19 wrote:Is it just me, or are Cooley’s vocals on his two songs kind of muddled? Almost seem clearer in the live recordings I’ve heard of both songs. Love both songs, just interested in why the mixing sounds like it does.
Patterson addressed this on the super secret 3DD Facebook group. Short version, Cooley mixed his songs exactly how he wanted them. Also, many of use aren't noticing this low vocals thing. Some definitely are. It seems to me that most of those with issues with the vocals are listening to MP3 or streaming services.
Turn you demons into walls of goddamned noise and sound.

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Rocky
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Rocky »

My honey got me the pre-order for Christmas (I found one that really gets me!) and it surprisingly arrived the day after the album was released.

I held out listening to The Unraveling until I got it in my hot little hands. After reading some early reviews (some of them here) I was not expecting to like this record as much as I do. There are lyrical moments on this record that are just simply outstanding. Seriously. Such as Our time was etched in promise until the truth came down upon us descending all our hopes into despair AND Give in to the clenching creeping into your fist AND This ain’t the country that our grandad’s fought for us to be AND I’m sorry we’ve forsaken every lesson we’ve been taught AND Our souls cry out for the better angels we have lost, in the end we’re just standing watching greatness fade. Things that many of us were thinking and a thankfully poet(s) put them into verse. :mrgreen:

There are three songs to me that are instantly vaulted into the Great DBT Cannon (all caps!) and those are Slow Ride Argument, Babies in Cages and Awaiting Resurrection. Slow Ride Argument is my favorite song on the record (Thanks Cooley) but I think Babies In Cages is the song that I will share with everyone I’m trying to convert to realize that the Truckers are the best rock band today. I simply can not get Awaiting Resurrection out of my head. The first time I heard it I thought (perhaps incorrectly) Oh Shit - this is the Truckers’ version of an old delta blues song.

I also like Thoughts and Prayers (as someone said earlier the What It Means on this record which I like better than What It Means – not that there is a contest) and Rosemary with a Bible and a Gun which is really growing on me. I like the addition of the strings and think they are used to great effect on Rosemary.

The remainder of the songs don’t push my buttons but that’s entirely OK. Any artist worth their salt will continually push their art to places that don’t resonate with every single person. And God knows Cooley and Patterson have written a shit ton of amazing songs and I’m sure Patterson’s throwaway songs are WAAAY better than the songs I’ve written and thought were brilliant.

Considering the times we live in I would be disappointed with a bunch of happy ass songs. Perhaps you would be too. These guys are simply too smart and well thought out to ignore the current crap–filled climate of today. And thank God for that.
By the time you drop them I'll be gone
And you'll be right where they fall the rest of your life

boyyourself
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by boyyourself »

My current rankings, because, why not:

1. SRO
1. D Day
1. Dirty South
1. Pizza Deliverance

2. Unraveling
2. Blessing and a Curse
2. Brighter than Creations Dark
2. American Band
2. Gangstabilly

3. Go Go Boots
3. Big To Do
3. English oceans

That was fun. I

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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Iowan »

boyyourself wrote:My current rankings, because, why not:

1. SRO
1. D Day
1. Dirty South
1. Pizza Deliverance

2. Unraveling
2. Blessing and a Curse
2. Brighter than Creations Dark
2. American Band
2. Gangstabilly

3. Go Go Boots
3. Big To Do
3. English oceans

That was fun. I
I'll play:

Decoration Day
The Dirty South
Southern Rock Opera
A Blessing and a Curse

Pizza Deliverance
The Unraveling
American Band
Gangstabilly
Brighter Than Creation's Dark

The Big to Do
English Oceans
Go Go Boots

KcGhostToMost
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by KcGhostToMost »

I love all the DBTs albums for different reasons but I would definitely put this one(The Unraveling) in my top 3 ever along with Brighter Than Creations Dark and Go Go Boots due to the unbelievable writing of Patterson on this one. His best writing overall start to finish on a record ever in my opinion.

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Smitty
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Smitty »

beantownbubba wrote:Did you know that smitty autocorrects to snotty?
I've been called that and worse :D
Better than shitty I guess :lol:
Thanks btb
glennrwordman wrote: (And your signature: once more we saw stars? Speaking of pain, there's a memoir of the same title by Jayson Greene. It's one of the most extraordinary books I've ever read, but fair warning: it deals with the death of a very young child, and it can be extremely difficult, but so, so worth it. https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/book ... on-greene/)
Thanks for the recommendation! I'm about of a masochist when it comes to art; I like it heavy as possible be it lit/film/music or whatever, so it sounds right in my wheelhouse.
My sig is from Dante by way of William Styron, taken from his memoir Darkness Visible which quite literally saved my life. It should be required reading for anyone who's struggled with severe depression or suicidal ideation.
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jimmyjack
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by jimmyjack »

Ah hell why not:

Decoration Day
The Dirty South
Go Go Boots
Brighter Than Creation’s Dark
Pizza Deliverance
English Oceans
Southern Rock Opera
The Unraveling
Gangstabilly
American Band
A Blessing & A Curse
The Big To Do

I will be repping for GGB with my last breath

Zip Up to Michigan
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Zip Up to Michigan »

The Dirty South
Southern Rock Opera
Decoration Day
It’s Great To Be Alive (I know it’s not studio but I love this one so much)
Brighter Than Creation’s Dark
Pizza Deliverance
A Blessing and a Curse
The Big To Do
Go Go Boots
Gangstabilly
American Band
The Unraveling
English Oceans

Crazy to have EO as last place as I think it’s a decent record. Goes to show how strong the catalog truly is. For me the big takeaway is the last three are clearly the weakest in my mind. I also tend to lean heavily on my personal tastes in song writing and creativity when I rank albums. If i was only considering sound/production, then the new album would be very high.

coornelius
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by coornelius »

The Dirty South
Decoration Day
Brighter Than Creation’s Dark
Southern Rock Opera
American Band
Pizza Deliverance
The Big To Do
English Oceans
A Blessing and a Curse
The Unraveling
Gangstabilly
Go Go Boots

I think. Though I just listened to GGB this week for the first time in years, and if you cut Assholes, Fireplace Poker, and Thanksgiving Filter, it's a lot better.

Zip Up to Michigan
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Zip Up to Michigan »

coornelius wrote:The Dirty South
Decoration Day
Brighter Than Creation’s Dark
Southern Rock Opera
American Band
Pizza Deliverance
The Big To Do
English Oceans
A Blessing and a Curse
The Unraveling
Gangstabilly
Go Go Boots

I think. Though I just listened to GGB this week for the first time in years, and if you cut Assholes, Fireplace Poker, and Thanksgiving Filter, it's a lot better.
I think the same could be said for The Unraveling if you cut 21st Century, Thoughts and Prayers and (the albeit improved studio version of) Babies in Cages. You replace those with two or three Cooley tracks, or more creative song writing on those topics at hand, then you’ve got one hell of a record.

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Clams
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Clams »

coornelius wrote:The Dirty South
Decoration Day
Brighter Than Creation’s Dark
Southern Rock Opera
American Band
Pizza Deliverance
The Big To Do
English Oceans
A Blessing and a Curse
The Unraveling
Gangstabilly
Go Go Boots

I think. Though I just listened to GGB this week for the first time in years, and if you cut Assholes, Fireplace Poker, and Thanksgiving Filter, it's a lot better.
Why would you cut those songs? Even if you believe they dilute the record (which I 100% disagree with btw), isn't the world a better place with those three songs in it?? Seriously.
Everyone needs a friend, everyone needs a fuck

woollyB
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by woollyB »

coornelius wrote:Why would you cut those songs? Even if you believe they dilute the record (which I 100% disagree with btw), isn't the world a better place with those three songs in it?? Seriously.
I have long thought that Big To Do and Go Go Boots are two middling DBT albums that could've been one great one. Not unlike GNR Use Your Illusion in that regard.

For that matter, I also think BTCD would be a stronger album if they cut the weakest five songs (although I realize we'd never find a consensus on which five that means).

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Clams
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Clams »

woollyB wrote:
For that matter, I also think BTCD would be a stronger album if they cut the weakest five songs (although I realize we'd never find a consensus on which five that means).
Well I can think of three right off the bat :lol:
Everyone needs a friend, everyone needs a fuck

woollyB
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by woollyB »

I'll play!

SRO
TDS
DD
English Oceans
BTCD
Big To Do
Pizza Deliverance
American Band
Gangstabilly
Unraveling
Blessing and a Curse
Go Go Boots

SRO, TDS, DD can go in any order, but there are no other reasonable contenders for top 3 status. Just my heavy handed opinion, of course ;-)

After that it gets more difficult and the albums are almost all pairs in my mind:

Gangstabilly and Pizza Deliverance are obviously less polished but have some real classics.

Blessing and a Curse and Brighter Than Creation’s Dark are uneven and the latter just has too many songs.

The Big To Do and Go Go Boots, recorded at the same time, could've been culled down to a classic single record. Instead we have several Shonna songs that I assume were the price of trying to keep the bass player happy.

English Oceans and American Band - I love these albums and the dawn of the Patton era.

The Unraveling seems solid on the first few listens but I might be suffering a little Patterson fatigue. He seems to be simultaneously writing songs that he could write in his sleep, and also trying too hard to make every song an "important statement."

Cole Younger
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Re: The Unraveling

Post by Cole Younger »

No love for The Fine Print, folks? I like it better than two and possibly three of their proper albums. That’s more of an endorsement of The Fine Print than an indictment of those three albums.
A single shot rifle and a one eyed dog.

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