Incredibly sad after tonight's show....

[bravos66]

I am choosing to post this on TDD because although I have been mostly a lurker here I have always been impressed by the general respectfulness of this group of fans as compared with those who would respond with, for example, "great, asshole, shorter beer lines for me".

After tonight's show, I am convinced that my favorite band has left me behind.

I've been a fan since DD and have seen probably 60 or so shows since including nine straight years at homecoming. And while my personal politics have always been to the right of the band's (and most other musicians I cherish), I've always respected their right to express their opinions and have been nothing short of amazed at the nuance and craft they have used to do so. I have always felt welcome and have indeed introduced countless friends to the splendor of the Rock Show.

I was very concerned when I began hearing the pre-releases from the new album but was incredibly relieved when I heard it all in context and in fact think its their finest work in many years.

But tonight's show at the Tab confirmed my worst fears. The stage comments from the band were angry, divisive and frankly made me feel that someone like myself with a different perspective was simply not welcome any longer. This is not what I have come to know and love about this band, and that does make me very sad.

I completely respect the right for everyone in this community, fan and musician alike, to have an individual perspective and have the freedom to share that in what hopefully is a space of mutual respect. I personally chose to vote for neither of the major party presidential candidates because I felt neither were worthy of the office, but I don't feel either wrong or stupid because I believe the voice of the people should be respected. The band obviously does not share that sentiment, which is their right, but the way they voiced their dissent was strident and condescending and I for one do not find entertainment in getting lectured from a stage, even from a group of guys that I love dearly.

[tinnitus photography]

collateral damage.

hope you enjoy Trumpland, because a lot of people won't.

[whatwouldcooleydo?]

just in case you want to relive it all.....

http://bt.etree.org/details.php?id=589892

Drive-By Truckers
The Tabernacle
Atlanta, Georgia
11/19/2016

Source: Schoeps CCM4V's>Lunatec V2>Benchmark AD2K>
Sound Devices 722 (24/44)
FOB/DFC/KFC/ZFC/AARP Clamped To The Balcony Rail
DSP: Sound Devices 722>Sound Forge 10.0>CD Wave>flac(16)
ID3 Tagged In Foobar 2000
Recorded By: Z-Man
Seeded By: Z-Man

Disc I

01 Greeting
02 Filthy and Fried
03 Two Daughters And A Beautiful Wife
04 Women Without Whiskey >
05 Darkened Flags on the Cusp of Dawn
06 Surrender Under Protest >
07 Sinkhole
08 Uncle Frank
09 The Living Bubba
10 *#First Air Of Autmn
11 #The Guns Of Umpqua
12 Banter
13 Ramon Casiano
14 Ever South
15 Kinky Hypocrite
16 Gimme Some Truth
17 *Once They Banned Imagine


Once They Banned Imagine

Disc II

01 #What It Means
02 Banter
03 Love Like This
04 The Company I Keep
05 Gravity's Gone
06 Let There Be Rock >
07 Zip City >
08 Shut Up And Get On The Plane
09 Hell No, I Ain't Happy >
10 Sign O' The Times >
11 Hell No, I Ain't Happy >
12 Rockin' In The Free World

* Mike Cooley On Acoustic Guitar
# Patterson Hood On Acoustic Guitar

Patterson Hood - Guitar And Vocals
Mike Cooley - Guitar And Vocals
Brad Morgan- Drums
Jay Gonzales - Keyboards, Guitar, And Vocals
Matt Patton - Bass And Vocals

[Smitty]

My politics align almost perfectly with the band's and I'll agree that they (particularly Cooley) were especially angry tonight, but what was said that was so terrible? That we should be "angry, not afraid", "redneck is not something to aspire to, but something to overcome", the rant about the marketing ploys by the NRA/gun manufacturers are bullshit, or that women are actually worth something?

[bravos66]

Thanks, Smitty for the considered response. My concern was a little bit about the message and a lot more about the delivery. Guess I don't believe that things are as black and white as many people and politicians would like them to be, and I tend to have an instinctive recoil against being preached to from either extreme.

Once again, I am by no means a Trump supporter but I can't help but think that many of the characters from the songs I love most such as Frank and the narrator from Sinkhole were squarely in Trump's target audience and might have listened pretty intently to at least part of what he had to say. The band played both of those songs last night, just wonder if that's where their heads and hearts are anymore?

[potatoeater]

such as Frank and the narrator from Sinkhole were squarely in Trump's target audience and might have listened pretty intently to at least part of what he had to say. The band played both of those songs last night, just wonder if that's where their heads and hearts are anymore?

The Truckers tell stories with characters. It has never necessarily meant that they agree with or see things the way their characters do. They are just telling their stories, sometimes directly from the POV of the character. For as who these two characters would theoretically have voted for in this election, that is neither here nor there. Just to entertain the thought though... the songs hold a sharp focus on specific issues. The farmer could easily lean left in his views in regard to the banking industry, if he is educated on the matter that is. I guess I couldn't as easily say the same for Uncle Frank. I mean if Frank looks at TVA solely from the perspective that a goddamn Democratic President just signed away my life with the TVA Act, sure he might have voted Republican. But the way I see it is the TVA was absolutely necessary. Sure a lot of people were overlooked, pushed aside and did not come out better on the other end of this deal. Maybe Uncle Frank just didn't have a place in the ever growing and changing world. It is never mentioned in the song exactly how Frank saw the TVA. One can paint a picture or assumption based on the context but there is never a direct statement in support or opposition to the TVA. Maybe he saw the necessity of the TVA and knew that while it was crucial for the future of the country, especially the southeast, he just didn't have a place in this exciting new world and decided it was his time to go. Everything isn't so black and white, you know?

[Zip City]

If I were DBT, I'd be mad at the realization that many of their characters WOULD be Trump supporters

[bravos66]

Well played, Zip!

[brett27295]

After tonight's show, I am convinced that my favorite band has left me behind.

That truly sucks. Sorry you feel that way.

[potatoeater]

I added a bit more to my post up there.

[Clams]

If I were DBT, I'd be mad at the realization that many of their characters WOULD be Trump supporters

That realization is ironic and definitely interesting. But given that they sing mainly about people and places in the deep south, and given the redness of the map down there, it actually makes sense. I'm sure Patterson and Cooley came to that realization a long time ago.

Bummer for you, Bravos. I'd probably feel the same way if my politics were like yours.

[Swamp]

You didn't really expect to not get a "collateral damage" type statement on this board did you?
This ain't the political thread but this a very poltical band. One of the best weekends of my life was the 2009 homecoming.
Obama had just been elected the band was happy, we got the request show along with 2 more killer shows. We met some of the best people ever. I was never into the whole punk scene and with all the angry dems running around these days, a 40 watt full of angry people doesn't sound too appealing right now.
The guy that turned me on to this band has always been very liberal and very quik to anger which I have always managed to do during our many political conversation. Yesterday we had a brief conversation about the election. He teared up as he told me how he teared up standing in the voting booth. He had voted dem all his life and now he was casting his vote for Trump.
I'm one of the dickwads that voted my conscience and not the lesser of two evils so I had to ask him why. Then with a tear still in his eye he quoted Reagan and said because my party left me. As he drove away I told my son that I felt bad for him. Then we both laughed and went back to work.

[beantownbubba]

Incredibly sad after reading this post...

I wasn't there, I didn't listen to the recording, I don't know what was said. But for purposes of this post it almost doesn't matter. Everything is broken. We need lessons in how to talk and listen to each other before we can even start on actually talking and listening to each other.

Bravos, if you have the subtlety and sophistication to listen to American Band with appreciation even though you might disagree w/ some of the views expressed, then I would think you also ought to be able to listen to Cooley and/or Hood from the stage and not take a couple of sentences as nuanced discourse on complex issues or as personal attacks. One of the amazing things about the album, particularly reflected in songs like "What it Means" and "Imagine" is how much Hood & Cooley can say in a pop song and capture nuance and subtlety while getting their message across. That's not really possible in commentary from the stage during a rock show and it's unfair to assume the worst based on what is essentially a soundbite.

If the band's message(s) was not really that controversial but their delivery was divisive and interfered with communicating that message, then Hood & Cooley have to understand that if they're going to take on the role of framing and participating in "the national debate," then they need to be part of the solution, not add to the problem. They need to be careful about what they say and how they say it, not in terms of diluting the message(s) they want to convey, but in understanding how to get across in this particular moment of cultural time and in the particular moment between songs at a rock show. It just so happens that they have a platform, and they can use it merely to express anger or to add value. If one has something useful to offer and wants to direct that anger in a meaningful way then one has to adapt what one says to the time, place and manner in which one says it.

But saying that is not to say that there's anything wrong with taking an actual position on an actual issue. If everyone agreed w/ a statement, it wouldn't be an issue in the first place and it wouldn't be worth talking about. We've all somehow become confused between the message, the messenger and the audience in a way that taking a position has become almost synonymous with giving and taking personal offense. In a word, that's just nuts. As has been observed a lot recently, the political has become personal. That's not a good thing and makes it difficult to discuss the political. Would it be better if we all spoke in the most extreme version of politician-speak, saying nothing, giving nobody any "ammunition" to take offense at or even anything to disagree with and generally speaking like a lobotomized doll?

We are all too sensitive. We all look for excuses to confirm our positions/biases such as giving comments the worst possible interpretation, taking sentences out of the context of paragraphs or whole essays, assuming personal insult is intended without any evidence that the speaker harbors us (in particular or in general) any ill will, disqualifying a person from our respect or our vote based on their position on a single issue or sometimes even a single comment they make, etc, etc. I don't know if this explains what was said or what was heard last nite, but I know it's the world in which we currently live and that this attitude now colors in some way everything we say and everything we hear even if in general we don't believe we're the kind of people who acts that way.

I suspect that, as usual, the truth lies somewhere in the middle, i.e., the comments themselves were probably not that surprising but the delivery or some of the word choices or syntax may have obscured the intended message while turning off some of those who might otherwise be willing to listen.

Edit: When talking about the need for mutual respect, it's probably a good idea to spell the other person's name correctly. Sorry about that.

[John A Arkansawyer]

My first impulse on reading this was to tear you a new asshole, but I'm not as good at it as Mister Cooley, and besides, you're probably still trying to sew up the fresh ones from last night. I don't care to kick most men when they're down.

I never expected to hear Shut Up And Get On The Plane introduced with a talk about voting in off-year elections myself.

But that's what I needed. I am that man who is down and being kicked right now. Mister Cooley and his brothers lifted me up last night. I'd rather have love lift me, but sometimes anger is all that works.

So in the interest of trying to see something good, let me say I'm glad for you that you don't need saving just now.

[ramonz]

My first impulse on reading this was to tear you a new asshole.....

I couldn't disagree more. Maybe we could elevate the discourse a bit? Bravo66, I hope you stick around.

[bravos66]

Thanks to all for confirming my belief that this is maybe the last place on the interwebs where people can have a civilized discourse about differences....

So maybe my antennae were raised a bit too high last night, or maybe I simply hadn't had enough to drink. But I do find some validation that I wasn't just imagining things with the fact that a few of you who were there and feel differently than I do recognize that something was different.

This all comes as an aftermath from my Southern Baptist upbringing. After all of that, I just don't react very well to anybody getting in my face and telling me how I should think, feel or behave.

So I don't know how I'm ultimately going to deal with this, but even if I decide to take a break from shows for a while I will continue to listen to the music and hang out here every so often. Ya'll are good folks, and that's something that's not determined by politics, religion, or any of the thousand other things that seems to be dividing people these days.

[Zip Up to Michigan]

If I were DBT, I'd be mad at the realization that many of their characters WOULD be Trump supporters

I'm pretty sure they realized and understood some of their characters were of this type a LONG time ago. I'm sure it was intentional.

As for the OP, I'll be honest with you in saying I'm not too impressed with their banter, either. I'm in total agreement with them but I've always been in the "shut up and sing" crowd - when their music (especially the new record ) - is to the point and perfectly expresses the dialogue/conversation without the need of additional banter. It's that art that makes them so good!

With that said, I respect their right to further express their opinion on the platform they have built and deserve, in any way they should chose. I find it quite incredible that someone who has seen 60+ shows, probably understands their material as good as anyone, and loves the new record, would call it quits after a few comments of pointed stage banter. Unbelievable, really.

[Zip Up to Michigan]

Incredibly sad after reading this post...

I wasn't there, I didn't listen to the recording, I don't know what was said. But for purposes of this post it almost doesn't matter. Everything is broken. We need lessons in how to talk and listen to each other before we can even start on actually talking and listening to each other.

Bravos, if you have the subtlety and sophistication to listen to American Band with appreciation even though you might disagree w/ some of the views expressed, then I would think you also ought to be able to listen to Cooley and/or Hood from the stage and not take a couple of sentences as nuanced discourse on complex issues or as personal attacks. One of the amazing things about the album, particularly reflected in songs like "What it Means" and "Imagine" is how much Hood & Cooley can say in a pop song and capture nuance and subtlety while getting their message across. That's not really possible in commentary from the stage during a rock show and it's unfair to assume the worst based on what is essentially a soundbite.

If the band's message(s) was not really that controversial but their delivery was divisive and interfered with communicating that message, then Hood & Cooley have to understand that if they're going to take on the role of framing and participating in "the national debate," then they need to be part of the solution, not add to the problem. They need to be careful about what they say and how they say it, not in terms of diluting the message(s) they want to convey, but in understanding how to get across in this particular moment of cultural time and in the particular moment between songs at a rock show. It just so happens that they have a platform, and they can use it merely to express anger or to add value. If one has something useful to offer and wants to direct that anger in a meaningful way then one has to adapt what one says to the time, place and manner in which one says it.

But saying that is not to say that there's anything wrong with taking an actual position on an actual issue. If everyone agreed w/ a statement, it wouldn't be an issue in the first place and it wouldn't be worth talking about. We've all somehow become confused between the message, the messenger and the audience in a way that taking a position has become almost synonymous with giving and taking personal offense. In a word, that's just nuts. As has been observed a lot recently, the political has become personal. That's not a good thing and makes it difficult to discuss the political. Would it be better if we all spoke in the most extreme version of politician-speak, saying nothing, giving nobody any "ammunition" to take offense at or even anything to disagree with and generally speaking like a lobotomized doll?

We are all too sensitive. We all look for excuses to confirm our positions/biases such as giving comments the worst possible interpretation, taking sentences out of the context of paragraphs or whole essays, assuming personal insult is intended without any evidence that the speaker harbors us (in particular or in general) any ill will, disqualifying a person from our respect or our vote based on their position on a single issue or sometimes even a single comment they make, etc, etc. I don't know if this explains what was said or what was heard last nite, but I know it's the world in which we currently live and that this attitude now colors in some way everything we say and everything we hear even if in general we don't believe we're the kind of people who acts that way.

I suspect that, as usual, the truth lies somewhere in the middle, i.e., the comments themselves were probably not that surprising but the delivery or some of the word choices or syntax may have obscured the intended message while turning off some of those who might otherwise be willing to listen.

Edit: When talking about the need for mutual respect, it's probably a good idea to spell the other person's name correctly. Sorry about that.

I didn't read much of the thread before I posted but had I done so, I probably wouldn't have needed to post at all, as this is right on the money. You nailed it beantownbubba, nice job. Enjoyed the bolded, especially.

[John A Arkansawyer]

My first impulse on reading this was to tear you a new asshole.....

I couldn't disagree more.

I'm pretty sure a factual statement on my part about my mood is a true opinion. And you'll notice I didn't go on to do so.

[ramonz]

My first impulse on reading this was to tear you a new asshole.....

I couldn't disagree more.

I'm pretty sure a factual statement on my part about my mood is a true opinion. And you'll notice I didn't go on to do so.

True. My bad. Just hoping we never hijack tolerance here (not that you were), as it works best when it's free to be an aspiration to differing opinions. Bravo's thoughtful post didn't paint him (or his opinion) as worthy of rejection or disdain or dismissal. As someone we all know well once said, "I can feel his pain." And it sucks that he feels that way. And I hope he sticks around, because this place would be boring as shit if we all drank from the same Kool-Aid.

[Markalanbishop]

I'm confused, Bravos. On the one hand you state that neither candidate is worthy of being president while on the other you complain about DBT criticizing the result of the election. You also state that the will of the people should be heard and respected. Are you talking about the popular vote, which HRC will win by approximately 2 million people, or the results of the Electoral College? Which, by the way, was established as yet another compromise with slave holding states--along with the 3/5th Clause. All I heard last night was Cooley issuing a call to arms to fight for the rights I believe most reasonable people believe in. So if you think that Trump and his racism, sexism, xenophobia, etc. are not worthy of the presidency what exactly are you upset about? I've heard much "worse" from Cooley--as have you. Remember a couple of years ago at HC when Cooley called the Chief Justice of the Alabama Supreme Court a goat fucker because of his anti-LGBT opinions? The Chief Justice is an expression of the will of the "good people of Alabama" correct? Should that will be respected? If the answer is yes, then I for one will not accept the will of the people. I'm going to get mad and stay mad. Anyway, I hope you stick around and keep coming to the Rock Shows. This too shall pass.

[Clams's friend Deb]

I'm sorry that you felt uncomfortable with what was said onstage. I'm also trying to figure out how I'd feel if a band I loved were highly vocal Trump supporters and I have to respect your ability to separate their art from their politics. I'm not sure that I could do it. I certainly can't speak for DBT, but when I heard their comments, I recognized a mixture of anger and disbelief hardening into determination to fight for what is important that seems akin to what I'm feeling right now. What Cooley had to say in the intro to "Love Like This" hit home with me. For many people, myself included, hearing women reduced to objects to be grabbed if attractive enough and insulted for their looks and opinions is horrifying.I know that at least three of the band members are fathers of daughters. As a Southerner, I'm also horrified to see civil rights and human rights set back the way it appears they will be. Add to that the fact that we have a President-elect who probably couldn't pass a high school civics exam. Some of us are struggling with that right now and some of us are angry. I know I am.

All that to say, I appreciate your open-minded attitude and I'm sorry you felt preached at. I can see why you would. Again, I can't speak for DBT, but it sounds like they were reacting to a situation that strikes many people, myself included, as an immediate danger to what we see as progress for all Americans. I'll bet they weren't talking to open-minded folks like you, but it ruined your evening. I've never been one to wish artists would "shut up and sing". I don't think you lose your right to speak when you pick up a guitar. You have the same right to your opinions, bravos66, and I hope you'll stay around.

*Clams is in now way responsible for the opinions expressed herein.

[bravos66]

Deb, it's a learned skill. Figured out pretty quickly if I couldn't separate music from personal beliefs I wouldn't be listening to anyone who's recorded since about 1962! Although I do love me some Capitol-era Sinatra....

Thanks for the kind words and empathy!

[Flea]

This all comes as an aftermath from my Southern Baptist upbringing.

Now THERE'S the problem! I can say that as a Southern Baptist Deacon's son. Those fuckers mess up more kids than Jared from Subway and Roman Catholic pederast hypocrites combined.

[John A Arkansawyer]

*Clams is in now way responsible for the opinions expressed herein.

If we can't blame Clams, then the terrorists have won. And we all know whose fault that would be.

[Cole Younger]

I am choosing to post this on TDD because although I have been mostly a lurker here I have always been impressed by the general respectfulness of this group of fans as compared with those who would respond with, for example, "great, asshole, shorter beer lines for me".

After tonight's show, I am convinced that my favorite band has left me behind.

I've been a fan since DD and have seen probably 60 or so shows since including nine straight years at homecoming. And while my personal politics have always been to the right of the band's (and most other musicians I cherish), I've always respected their right to express their opinions and have been nothing short of amazed at the nuance and craft they have used to do so. I have always felt welcome and have indeed introduced countless friends to the splendor of the Rock Show.

I was very concerned when I began hearing the pre-releases from the new album but was incredibly relieved when I heard it all in context and in fact think its their finest work in many years.

But tonight's show at the Tab confirmed my worst fears. The stage comments from the band were angry, divisive and frankly made me feel that someone like myself with a different perspective was simply not welcome any longer. This is not what I have come to know and love about this band, and that does make me very sad.

I completely respect the right for everyone in this community, fan and musician alike, to have an individual perspective and have the freedom to share that in what hopefully is a space of mutual respect. I personally chose to vote for neither of the major party presidential candidates because I felt neither were worthy of the office, but I don't feel either wrong or stupid because I believe the voice of the people should be respected. The band obviously does not share that sentiment, which is their right, but the way they voiced their dissent was strident and condescending and I for one do not find entertainment in getting lectured from a stage, even from a group of guys that I love dearly.

Glad you posted this. I am really sorry you felt and feel that way. I can sympathize for sure because my politics is similar to yours. I normally vote libertarian (I didn't vote in this election) but describe myself as a guy who is a conservative in terms of how he lives his own life but feel that the libertarians are the closest to being right (correct). I know what you mean. You didn't ask for my advice but it's free so...

First, don't give up on the band. There are a lot of raw emotions right now. I'll forego getting too deep into my own view of what's at play here because this isn't the political thread but we aren't even two weeks removed from the election. So don't give up on because things will almost certainly settle down a little in terms of the pointedness of what they say or how they say it.

Second, I'm very much in the minority here politically. I've always been clear and honest with everyone here about where I stand because it comes up due to the political nature of this band and I'm pretty passionate about politics and don't want to fly under false colors. But I do want to make something g really clear about the folks here, I've been treated like family by the vast majority of the folks I've met from this board. I've had a really great time at shows with a lot of people who post here. I know they think I'm wrong almost always when it comes to politics. But it's not a problem. Nobody cares. Don't feel like you aren't welcome. There may be a few people who feel that way but not many. And if that's how they feel, who cares? That's their problem and like I said, they are in the minority.

Last, a member here who posts fairly often who I have become friends with and rocked out with at shows gave me some very sound advice where this is concerned. I was a little aggravated about something, not that the band had said, but their delivery (I get it and will address that in a bit). He said, "I know what you mean. But the way I always try to look at it is, the key is to not take it personally."

I completely get what you mean when you say it's not their politics, it's the way they are saying what they say and their general attitude. Hell the press release for American Band was pretty off putting if you don't agree with them politically in terms of tone. The whole, "don't let the door knob hit you in the ass if you have an issue with this." seemed unnecessary. But again, don't take it personal. I don't have much of anything in common with my favorite artists politically and that isn't a problem for me. But the whole condescending feel of some of it can be a bit much sometimes. When I heard some of the stage banter I rolled my eyes so hard I nearly pulled a muscle. I hate what Trump said about a "nasty woman" even though I don't like Hillary Clinton. But come on, let's not act like worse hasn't come out of the mouths of democrats about Sarah Palin. And no i was never a Palin fan either. In the end you have to make the best decision for yourself about this. But I want to reiterate not to give up on the band because I think the intensity of the political stuff is temporary in terms of the over the top angry aspect of it. And there are some great people here who couldn't care less that you don't agree with the band's politics.

I knew it was kind of going to be like this. I'm from and live in Georgia. I passed on both the Macon show and the Atlanta show because I was pretty sure there would be a lot of this sort of thing and while I'm no Trump guy, I just knew that it would probably take a lot of the joy out of the shows for me. Hang in there. It would be a shame to miss out on the band altogether and a shame to miss out on meeting some great people. That's my two cents.

[DebbieTrucker]

I've loved all their comments from day one and mine are even further left then theirs lol. Yes that's possible. I think the country as a whole needs to quit being over sensitive about everything. Artists have always chosen their freedom of speech right in music, this is no different.

[Cole Younger]

I've loved all their comments from day one and mine are even further left then theirs lol. Yes that's possible. I think the country as a whole needs to quit being over sensitive about everything. Artists have always chosen their freedom of speech right in music, this is no different.

I'm all for everyone having thicker skin. If the artists can keep from busting a spring over politics then the fans can be held to the same standard where stage banter is concerned. I'm all for it.

[alquina]

I'm so sorry you feel this way and I sure hope you stick around.

[John A Arkansawyer]

So don't give up on because things will almost certainly settle down a little in terms of the pointedness of what they say or how they say it.

I'm not so sure of that, especially in Cooley's case. I could be wrong. It'll depend on how the politics go. If this turns out to be an average Republican administration, then you're probably right. If it's the shitshow I anticipate, well. I sure hope you are right.