Incredibly sad after tonight's show....

[DebbieTrucker]

Last time I checked Cooley and the rest of the band made it clear they didn't care who they offended and they weren't going to change on their political stance and being outspoken. God Bless them for that. Modern music is too submissive in thoughts and beliefs these days. If an artist wants to make and album and release it they have the right to put whatever they want on that album. You don't have to buy it. The same goes with their live shows to back the album. They have to have passion in what they are singing. If you don't like that support of their lyrical content at their shows, don't go. That simple. This is and has always been a liberal band. Am I the only one not shocked by this album and nightly banter that goes along with supporting their album? Sometimes I feel like I am lol.

[ramonz]

Last time I checked Cooley and the rest of the band made it clear they didn't care who they offended and they weren't going to change on their political stance and being outspoken. God Bless them for that.

To me, this isn't about whether they will change (doubtful) or if they should change (they should, of course, always follow their hearts), but about whether a decent person who has been to 9 Homecomings should bail on DBT because of the political banter at shows. Man, I sure hope not. As a good man once said, "that would be the saddest thing I ever seen." I've mentioned that DBT has made me a better person through their brave actions and examples (BLM sign, etc.), but I do think that if the goal is to get thousands of loyal fans like bravo66 to listen, the words you use and the manner in which you use them (I have not heard the show recordings yet) matter - if only because the tone can and does make a difference in whether people listen or tune out. But if the goal is to fire up the converted, then the (apparent) tone seems completely reasonable. In either case, I'd sure hate to see folks like bravo66 give up on a band that has brought so much JOY to their lives. One could make the argument that these aren't joyful times, so fuck "joy" right now. I think that's probably a pretty legit sentiment. But I'd also argue that when it's all said and done, and the DBT story is written, the joy part will be the most powerful element we describe to our grandkids when we reminisce that we were a part of something close to magical. Truth is this band can be both magical and important/necessary at the same time, and that's hard for even the very best to pull off. Hang in there bravo66 - I hope we can raise our glasses at HC '17. First round's on me. Let's watch these guys evolve together, proud of the long-term journey they're on and their unwavering commitment to positive change. They're smart folks - I have no doubt they're figuring out the most effective way to deliver their message.

[phungi]

Last time I checked Cooley and the rest of the band made it clear they didn't care who they offended and they weren't going to change on their political stance and being outspoken. God Bless them for that.

To me, this isn't about whether they will change (doubtful) or if they should change (they should, of course, always follow their hearts), but about whether a decent person who has been to 9 Homecomings should bail on DBT because of the political banter at shows. Man, I sure hope not. As a good man once said, "that would be the saddest thing I ever seen." I've mentioned that DBT has made me a better person through their brave actions and examples (BLM sign, etc.), but I do think that if the goal is to get thousands of loyal fans like bravo66 to listen, the words you use and the manner in which you use them (I have not heard the show recordings yet) matter - if only because the tone can and does make a difference in whether people listen or tune out. But if the goal is to fire up the converted, then the (apparent) tone seems completely reasonable. In either case, I'd sure hate to see folks like bravo66 give up on a band that has brought so much JOY to their lives. One could make the argument that these aren't joyful times, so fuck "joy" right now. I think that's probably a pretty legit sentiment. But I'd also argue that when it's all said and done, and the DBT story is written, the joy part will be the most powerful element we describe to our grandkids when we reminisce that we were a part of something close to magical. Truth is this band can be both magical and important/necessary at the same time, and that's hard for even the very best to pull off. Hang in there bravo66 - I hope we can raise our glasses at HC '17. First round's on me. Let's watch these guys evolve together, proud of the long-term journey they're on and their unwavering commitment to positive change. They're smart folks - I have no doubt they're figuring out the most effective way to deliver their message.

I will drink to that. Met some great people in 2015, and cant wait to hang out and meet others in 2017. Didn't consider political orientation then and won't consider it in February. Not that I expect it, but ramonz: you could show up wearing "Trump" stickers, pins, and regalia, and I will still accept this beer.

[beantownbubba]

Interesting phungi. I think I just witnessed my first beer interception. Knowing ramonz, I'm sure he'd be happy to buy you a beer (and come to think of it, one for me too) but you'll have to teach me how you slipped yourself into that conversation (and beer)

Very well said, ramonz.

[phungi]

Interesting phungi. I think I just witnessed my first beer interception. Knowing ramonz, I'm sure he'd be happy to buy you a beer (and come to think of it, one for me too) but you'll have to teach me how you slipped yourself into that conversation (and beer)

Very well said, ramonz.

simple creed: when ramonz is buying, there is a little bravo66 in all of us! happy to buy 2nd/3rd round!

[Flea]

Interesting phungi. I think I just witnessed my first beer interception. Knowing ramonz, I'm sure he'd be happy to buy you a beer (and come to think of it, one for me too) but you'll have to teach me how you slipped yourself into that conversation (and beer)

Very well said, ramonz.

simple creed: when ramonz is buying, there is a little bravo66 in all of us! happy to buy 2nd/3rd round!

But if he offers you something that looks like a small dot of candy on a piece of paper, politely decline.

[phungi]

Interesting phungi. I think I just witnessed my first beer interception. Knowing ramonz, I'm sure he'd be happy to buy you a beer (and come to think of it, one for me too) but you'll have to teach me how you slipped yourself into that conversation (and beer)

Very well said, ramonz.

simple creed: when ramonz is buying, there is a little bravo66 in all of us! happy to buy 2nd/3rd round!

But if he offers you something that looks like a small dot of candy on a piece of paper, politely decline.

is that how they got the pickle lighter from you?

[sactochris]

The job, in fact the very duty of an artist is to be true to their art and let the chips fall where they may. I'm sorry to hear that you feel left behind. I feel energized by the quality and intensity of the message that the band delivered on American Band. The sheer ferocity of the bands performances on this tour have only confirmed this for me. I think it took a lot of guts to drop such a political album. They stuck their necks out and I have a ton of respect for that. I for one have decided to get mad.

[whatwouldcooleydo?]

for some reason I can't these lyrics out of my head of late

Praise be to Nero's Neptune,
The Titanic sails at dawn.
Everybody's shouting,
"Which side are you on?"

[beantownbubba]

So I finally listened to the 2 clips Smitty posted in the Atlanta thread. I have to say that I don't see much that's objectionable about them and I hear a lot to like. I could stretch a point and say that "angry" isn't really the opposite of "scared" and that another term like "courageous" would have been better but that would be hair splitting at a very fine level and not an argument I'm prepared to defend very hard. The only thing I heard that might upset some people who are not more or less committed to the same views as Cooley was his comment that "redneck" is not something to aspire to, it's something to rise above. In context, it seems very clear to me that Cooley means the word in a very specific context and you'd have to be determined to believe he meant it differently to be upset by it. In shorthand, there's redneck as in an oppressed lower class (see, e.g. Nancy Isenberg's White Trash) and there's redneck as in a proud cultural, sort of ethnic, tradition (see, e.g. JD Vance, Hillbilly Elegy). Cooley clearly meant the former and if there is an implicit message that the latter is just another way to keep poor white folks barefoot, pregnant, high and hungry, that seems to me to be a legit position, too.

I thought Cooley's specific messages about the midterm elections and the denigration of women were positive and empowering, if i can use that beaten to death term. His comments about women being people too were very similar to the idea implicit in the Black Lives Matter poster, particularly that it's important to hear those messages from white southern men who might well be characterized by some as rednecks.

I stand by my earlier comments about the importance of leading responsibly and not just venting, but I heard nothing in those clips that is problematic by that standard and I heard a fair amount to admire. I understand that there were other statements made as well, but these are now the ones I've heard.

[Humboldt]

The job, in fact the very duty of an artist is to be true to their art and let the chips fall where they may. I'm sorry to hear that you feel left behind. I feel energized by the quality and intensity of the message that the band delivered on American Band. The sheer ferocity of the bands performances on this tour have only confirmed this for me. I think it took a lot of guts to drop such a political album. They stuck their necks out and I have a ton of respect for that. I for one have decided to get mad.

Couldn't agree more and double down on the "they stuck their necks out". They saw this shit show coming so they decided to write songs about their country and it's issues from their perspective. And they did it at the risk of themselves and their families. It was totally predicable that about 1/3 of the fan base would act as they have, attacking Patterson for What it Means and the band for the album. They knew it was going to come and that is why confronted before it even happened in the press release. Can you imagine the guts it took when you are trying to support your family on middle class type money as it is knowing about 1/3 of that might evaporate? Thankfully it looks like they've picked up more new fans then they lost.

And for what's going on now with Cooley the last few shows, did anyone expect anything less? He put his heart and soul into this album. Part of it was to have a hopefully collateral effect to help a democrat get elected (they wanted Bernie remember). It didn't happen. The disappointment had to have been huge. Anyone who put that much time and effort into a project and a goal is going to have a reaction. His reaction right now is to be pissed of. Totally natural and the same as mine. Almost everyone else I know is scared. Cooley simply urged us the other night to screw fear. Extremely wise words in my book. Drumpt is all about fear. That's how he got elected telling the masses that they had to be scared of things that only he could fix. I hope Cooley keeps spreading the word to not be afraid.

[brett27295]

is that how they got the pickle lighter from you?

No. I just stole the sonofabitch.

[ramonz]

Interesting phungi. I think I just witnessed my first beer interception. Knowing ramonz, I'm sure he'd be happy to buy you a beer (and come to think of it, one for me too) but you'll have to teach me how you slipped yourself into that conversation (and beer)

That is very funny - was thinking the same thing Like any good fungi, his spores have a way if wedging themselves into the tightest places.

[ramonz]

is that how they got the pickle lighter from you?

No. I just stole the sonofabitch.

True, but Flea was incapacitated at the time by the Pop Rocks....

[whatwouldcooleydo?]

his spores have a way if wedging themselves into the tightest places.

[beantownbubba]

That is very funny -

Well, he's a very fun guy. Or at least he thinks he is.

[Clams]

That is very funny -

Well, he's a very fun guy. Or at least he thinks he is.

The latter.

[Tequila Cowboy]

Yes, DBT is a liberal band and always has been. This is not entirely about politics though. Trump is not your average politician, he is a demagogue and a despot and our country is likely not going to survive him. This is about way more than politics.

[DebbieTrucker]

Yes, DBT is a liberal band and always has been. This is not entirely about politics though. Trump is not your average politician, he is a demagogue and a despot and our country is likely not going to survive him. This is about way more than politics.

Great post on every level!

[Cole Younger]

I feel like I should make something clear. I didn't disagree with what Cooley said. Not even the redneck part. I'm most definitely a redneck but of the two examples bubba gave, I'm the latter.

It's all the anger I don't care for. I do t begrudge them their anger. I just don't want to be part of it. I go to shows to have fun. Not to listen to people rage about how mad they are. I didn't find out where they stood politically when American Band was released. I've known it the whole time and never have cared. I personally just don't go to shows to here how pissed off people are. It's fine if they feel that way and they have every right to it. But I would feel the same way if a band more in line with my politics was on stage raising hell about the left wing. Don't want to hear it. It's the anger I don't want any part of. But lots of people feel differently about that and that's fine.

[Wolf]

I feel like I should make something clear. I didn't disagree with what Cooley said. Not even the redneck part. I'm most definitely a redneck but of the two examples bubba gave, I'm the latter.

It's all the anger I don't care for. I do t begrudge them their anger. I just don't want to be part of it. I go to shows to have fun. Not to listen to people rage about how mad they are. I didn't find out where they stood politically when American Band was released. I've known it the whole time and never have cared. I personally just don't go to shows to here how pissed off people are. It's fine if they feel that way and they have every right to it. But I would feel the same way if a band more in line with my politics was on stage raising hell about the left wing. Don't want to hear it. It's the anger I don't want any part of. But lots of people feel differently about that and that's fine.

i'm not sad or mad about how they do their live shows. i choose not to go either. lotta meanness comin' from the stage. i still enjoy my DBT CDs at the house

[Zip City]

Well they ARE mad and they've never censored their emotions on stage. And a lot of their fans are angry too, and sometimes there is something cathartic about being in a room like that where you can blow off that steam

[Cole Younger]

Well they ARE mad and they've never censored their emotions on stage. And a lot of their fans are angry too, and sometimes there is something cathartic about being in a room like that where you can blow off that steam

I know. I totally understand. I just don't want to be in the middle of it. Taking Patterson's advice.

[roland]

Yes, DBT is a liberal band and always has been. This is not entirely about politics though. Trump is not your average politician, he is a demagogue and a despot and our country is likely not going to survive him. This is about way more than politics.

I disagree. The country didn't collapse when W. Bush was elected and re-elected as the far left said it would, nor did it when Obama was elected twice as the far right thought. It's just an election, just a new president, and just four years.

[Zip City]

Yes, DBT is a liberal band and always has been. This is not entirely about politics though. Trump is not your average politician, he is a demagogue and a despot and our country is likely not going to survive him. This is about way more than politics.

I disagree. The country didn't collapse when W. Bush was elected and re-elected as the far left said it would, nor did it when Obama was elected twice as the far right thought. It's just an election, just a new president, and just four years.

Wrong on every count

[John A Arkansawyer]

The country didn't collapse when W. Bush was elected and re-elected as the far left said it would

Wrong on every count

So you're saying we need to Make America Great Again?

[Tequila Cowboy]

Yes, DBT is a liberal band and always has been. This is not entirely about politics though. Trump is not your average politician, he is a demagogue and a despot and our country is likely not going to survive him. This is about way more than politics.

I disagree. The country didn't collapse when W. Bush was elected and re-elected as the far left said it would, nor did it when Obama was elected twice as the far right thought. It's just an election, just a new president, and just four years.

This is not that. This is a narcissistic demagogue. It's not just politics.

[Humboldt]

Yes, DBT is a liberal band and always has been. This is not entirely about politics though. Trump is not your average politician, he is a demagogue and a despot and our country is likely not going to survive him. This is about way more than politics.

I disagree. The country didn't collapse when W. Bush was elected and re-elected as the far left said it would, nor did it when Obama was elected twice as the far right thought. It's just an election, just a new president, and just four years.

This is not that. This is a narcissistic demagogue. It's not just politics.

There is a video out today that someone snuck of Richard Spencer, the alt-right leader who Bannon bragged that Breitbart gives a platform too, giving a "victory" speech in DC last weekend saying "Hail Trump"! Much of the audience stands and chants Hail Trump holding their right arm up Nazi style. Spencer talks about how this country is the exclusive birthright of whites and uses German terms to describe the press. Straight out of 1930's Germany.

This shit is real folks. This isn't about being some good moderate Republican or Libertarian who doesn't vote Democratic for certain thought out reasons and principles and the person they elect, like a Bush. This is about a shallow, relatively low IQ, vindictive wannabe who has a hair trigger temper who has surrounded himself now with a propaganda peddling white male supremacist as his chief adviser.

I for one would be incredibly sad if the band didn't display anger and didn't motivate us to get mad and start to put a stop to this shit 2 years from now. The term "when good men do nothing" comes to mind. Hitler rose because good men did nothing. That this band is doing something makes me even more proud of them and proud to be a fan.

[John A Arkansawyer]

There is a video out today that someone snuck of Richard Spencer, the alt-right leader who Bannon bragged that Breitbart gives a platform too, giving a "victory" speech in DC last weekend saying "Hail Trump"! Much of the audience stands and chants Hail Trump holding their right arm up Nazi style. Spencer talks about how this country is the exclusive birthright of whites and uses German terms to describe the press. Straight out of 1930's Germany.

Here's the video:



You'll note The Atlantic gave him the benefit of the doubt by spelling it "hail" instead of "heil". Clearly, the media is already intimidated.

And here's the whole story. But if you don't have time to read it, I think this photo sums it up nicely:

[roland]

Yes, DBT is a liberal band and always has been. This is not entirely about politics though. Trump is not your average politician, he is a demagogue and a despot and our country is likely not going to survive him. This is about way more than politics.

I disagree. The country didn't collapse when W. Bush was elected and re-elected as the far left said it would, nor did it when Obama was elected twice as the far right thought. It's just an election, just a new president, and just four years.

Wrong on every count

No, I'm not. I just don't have the emotional investment in politics that you do. I'm coming from a perspective that you don't understand, the same way I fail to understand most of the boo-hoo hand-wringing going on. In four years, my life will be pretty much the same as it is today, but with a new asshole waiting in the wings. And yes, Hillary is an asshole, too, and I would care just as little if she had won.